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      08-27-2014, 10:48 AM   #221
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CatFlap View Post
Why do these 'experts' imply that power and torque are somehow independent variables? In fact, quite the opposite is true, and we should be clear on these facts:
  • POWER (the rate of doing WORK) is wholly dependent on TORQUE and RPM.
  • TORQUE and RPM are the MEASURED quantities of engine output.
  • POWER is CALCULATED from torque and RPM, by the following equation:

    HP = Torque x RPM ÷ 5252

You can't have more POWER without producing more TORQUE unless, that is, your engine can produce that SAME TORQUE at an increased RPM.

You can make a more meaningful comparison of the performance of a tuned engine by comparing the 'before and after' torque curves. The larger the area under the torque curve the greater the 'overall' performance, max POWER values do not tell the whole story!

Do these experts think they're addressing an audience, the bulk of whom are idiots?
This is not completely correct either. I can tune a motor with more torque and not affect horsepower, by where I apply the torque.

For example:

300 lb ft of torque at 5000 rpm is 285 hp

500 lb ft of torque at 2000 rpm is 190 hp

But the last tune (car) will break the rear tires lose and I will beat the higher hp car big-time in a short drag race, like from one light to the other. At higher rpm's and over a longer drag race the higher hp car will win because hp is the amount of work done over time (think 1/4 mil times, which is a useless unit of measure for modern street cars with access to so much torque). For street applications, take the higher torque every time because the power is 1000 rpm off idle whereas the other car has to get to 5000 rpm to get the benefit of the full torque. The first car above has a long linear power curve and the second car has an alpine curve, nearly vertical, from the start.

For cruising, torque is also more important than a big hp number. Look at large highway trucks with 12L motors putting out 475 hp and 1700 lb ft of torque. Granted the rpm curve is flat, but who cares when cruising with 6-8 speed tranny's.

Now, for the track, big torque over a lot more usable rpm (which means high hp) in lightweight cars, carefully engineered in the power curve (transmission and rear-end combo's), win races.
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      08-27-2014, 11:18 AM   #222
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 42pilot View Post
This is not completely correct either. I can tune a motor with more torque and not affect horsepower, by where I apply the torque.

For example:

300 lb ft of torque at 5000 rpm is 285 hp

500 lb ft of torque at 2000 rpm is 190 hp

But the last tune (car) will break the rear tires lose and I will beat the higher hp car big-time in a short drag race, like from one light to the other. At higher rpm's and over a longer drag race the higher hp car will win because hp is the amount of work done over time (think 1/4 mil times, which is a useless unit of measure for modern street cars with access to so much torque). For street applications, take the higher torque every time because the power is 1000 rpm off idle whereas the other car has to get to 5000 rpm to get the benefit of the full torque. The first car above has a long linear power curve and the second car has an alpine curve, nearly vertical, from the start.

For cruising, torque is also more important than a big hp number. Look at large highway trucks with 12L motors putting out 475 hp and 1700 lb ft of torque. Granted the rpm curve is flat, but who cares when cruising with 6-8 speed tranny's.

Now, for the track, big torque over a lot more usable rpm (which means high hp) in lightweight cars, carefully engineered in the power curve (transmission and rear-end combo's), win races.
It's far more meaningful to look at the torque / power at the driven wheels rather than the crankshaft - so that the whole 'power train' is considered...
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      08-27-2014, 12:15 PM   #223
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CatFlap View Post
It's far more meaningful to look at the torque / power at the driven wheels rather than the crankshaft - so that the whole 'power train' is considered...
Always. When building a motor, the engine dyno gets you a point of reference, then use a chassis dyno to finish the tune.

Manufacturer's numbers are crap anyway, but they are close for the crank.
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      08-27-2014, 12:26 PM   #224
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 42pilot View Post
This is not completely correct either. I can tune a motor with more torque and not affect horsepower, by where I apply the torque.

For example:

300 lb ft of torque at 5000 rpm is 285 hp

500 lb ft of torque at 2000 rpm is 190 hp

But the last tune (car) will break the rear tires lose and I will beat the higher hp car big-time in a short drag race, like from one light to the other. At higher rpm's and over a longer drag race the higher hp car will win because hp is the amount of work done over time (think 1/4 mil times, which is a useless unit of measure for modern street cars with access to so much torque). For street applications, take the higher torque every time because the power is 1000 rpm off idle whereas the other car has to get to 5000 rpm to get the benefit of the full torque. The first car above has a long linear power curve and the second car has an alpine curve, nearly vertical, from the start.

For cruising, torque is also more important than a big hp number. Look at large highway trucks with 12L motors putting out 475 hp and 1700 lb ft of torque. Granted the rpm curve is flat, but who cares when cruising with 6-8 speed tranny's.

Now, for the track, big torque over a lot more usable rpm (which means high hp) in lightweight cars, carefully engineered in the power curve (transmission and rear-end combo's), win races.
Every word of this is implied by the formula catflap posted, assuming one understands the formula. All theorizing about tq vs hp is rendered moot by HP=(TQxRPM)/5252. The formula tells the WHOLE story in one succinct expression.
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      08-27-2014, 01:34 PM   #225
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chiplee View Post
Every word of this is implied by the formula catflap posted, assuming one understands the formula. All theorizing about tq vs hp is rendered moot by HP=(TQxRPM)/5252. The formula tells the WHOLE story in one succinct expression.
Very few understand it and know how to apply it. And its not theorized - the numbers and results are facts. Good tuners understand the relationship of the numbers.

My point addresses catflap's comments that implied ACS is bullshitting the reader by increasing or addressing torque independently. HP and torque are independent. HP is the result and the remaining components are independent values. Again, my point is that you can reduce hp (the result and the misplaced holy grail), greatly increase torque and have a better performing street car.
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      09-14-2014, 03:29 PM   #226
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Stupid question. When you guys say you are running E/2 do you mean S2=E and S1=2?
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      09-14-2014, 03:42 PM   #227
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ray knight View Post
Stupid question. When you guys say you are running E/2 do you mean S2=E and S1=2?
I think that's what they mean. This is what S1 and S2 stand for on my tune:

-S1 on the Ultimate is an internal parameter and most gasoline engines remain at 1.

-S2 on the Ultimate calls different maps and changes power output.
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      09-15-2014, 11:40 AM   #228
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2thdr
Quote:
Originally Posted by greentrbo95gst View Post
Yes, couple bmw enthusiasts and known them for a while. Purchased bunch of products as well. Using a credit card always protects you from fraud or anything of that nature.
Oh sorry, wasn't worried about that. I meant in terms of issues with the vehicle post-insertion. Any dealer issues?

Also curious as to whether there is any possible way for the dealer to know that you have had this in place with your vehicle? Are operating parameters recorded by the vehicle in any way and then discoverable by the dealer when they hook them up to their systems?

Thank you.
To answer your question, yes. BMW installs black boxes in our cars. You sign a sheet being aware of that when you purchase a car. There's a lot if tunes out there that will even erase and clear codes. However that black box is still recording everything. If you have problems with the motor, your BMW dealership will connect to your car and look at the recorded data. So in the end they'll see that the car was running at a higher boost level than what the car was programmed with and know that the car has been tuned. BMW will walk away at that point. I know from personal experience.
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      09-15-2014, 12:51 PM   #229
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hmm interesting
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      10-21-2014, 12:35 AM   #230
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Hello guys...after i red all your posts i decided to get a racechip,the pro2 model...i own a X5 4.0d model,the F15 one....Racechip came with the E/0 setting,wich is about 15% increase in performance,according to Racechip staff...after about 100 km i changed the settings to E/2 and didnt have any problem....then,after a few more km i changed to 0/3,a setting suggested by the Racechip technik staff,setting wich they sad is on a similar engines that they have,and,unfortunatelly,at about 160Km/h and about 3500revs the engine start to choke.Is someone here who own a 4.0 model?if so,can you share a good setting for that model?i dont want to reach the 30% increase in power like Racechip claim is possible but around 25%,a ballance between power and consumption.
I want to thank you all for sharing your experience with rachip and thank you in advance for answer
I am living in Europe btw
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      07-12-2015, 05:11 PM   #231
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after 7 months no answer...ehhh,i took off the racechip pro from my car ...wish you all the best
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      07-12-2015, 06:50 PM   #232
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Quote:
Originally Posted by catapaul View Post
after 7 months no answer...ehhh,i took off the racechip pro from my car ...wish you all the best
Unfortunately very few 40d owners, and likely fewer on RaceChip.

I recommend you put up a duplicate threads under 540d, which has the same engine.
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      07-12-2015, 07:03 PM   #233
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Thank you for answer MattBianco but i quit using that rc pro....i tried several settings and engine stil choking after 3500 revs....without rc pro engine run smooth even at 230 km/h....once again thank you for suggestion,i wish you amd all BMW lovers,all the best
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      07-12-2015, 09:15 PM   #234
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Quote:
Originally Posted by catapaul View Post
Thank you for answer MattBianco but i quit using that rc pro....i tried several settings and engine stil choking after 3500 revs....without rc pro engine run smooth even at 230 km/h....once again thank you for suggestion,i wish you amd all BMW lovers,all the best
You should look at the diesel MPPK and several others mentioned here: http://f15.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1088501

Also, if money is not a concern, look at G Power.
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      01-19-2019, 12:47 PM   #235
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Codes after installation?

Hi yawl, installed a Race Chip GTS Black yesterday and this afternoon I threw the following codes. Anyone seen this before or have any ideas. Car is still running great and no discernable affect to performance. Thanks so much!
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