BMS 50i Tune (DIY)

[X5Jouster]

i guess once i hit 1000 miles ill be right ontop of burger tuning!! no offense to racechip, but i hear nothing but great things from my friends with burger products. just need to seat those piston rings!!

[opasha]

Originally Posted by X5Jouster

i guess once i hit 1000 miles ill be right ontop of burger tuning!! no offense to racechip, but i hear nothing but great things from my friends with burger products. just need to seat those piston rings!!

At least with burger, you'll have @r33 to easily help you because he is most familiar with their tunes. That's one advantage.

[bluelodge400]

Originally Posted by X5Jouster

keep us updated on the tune, performance and how you like it!!!

we dont want to thread jack

No worries, no one high jacked this thread! It’s great to hear everyone's stories, advice and opinions. That’s the point of this board!

I'll have more of an update after this weekend. I'm planning a trip to Napa. It will be a nice excuse to put miles on the new tune.

[BKMK5]

Originally Posted by opasha

What size wheels you guys running? I have stock suspension with 22's with 285/35r22 tires 38 psi front 44 psi rear, and the car handles pretty well. Sure, it's not as tight as my Infiniti FX35 (my preferred suspension tightness), but it still does really well in corners and similar situations that you described. I guess the larger wheels really make a big difference.

Standard 19" rims. The Cayenne S had 19s and handled a bit better in corners and had steel springs as well. For the little amount of money for the gains you get, the tunes are great. Just with the way the truck is setup (suspension and brakes) I don't think for me its worth the $600 for me. Especially with an F80 M3 in 7 months I'll have enough to play with then(and tune )

[opasha]

Originally Posted by BKMK5

Standard 19" rims. The Cayenne S had 19s and handled a bit better in corners and had steel springs as well. For the little amount of money for the gains you get, the tunes are great. Just with the way the truck is setup (suspension and brakes) I don't think for me its worth the $600 for me. Especially with an F80 M3 in 7 months I'll have enough to play with then(and tune )

Your point is valid . Enjoy the M3 - hope to see pictures of it!

[cy07]

Originally Posted by BKMK5

Standard 19" rims. The Cayenne S had 19s and handled a bit better in corners and had steel springs as well. For the little amount of money for the gains you get, the tunes are great. Just with the way the truck is setup (suspension and brakes) I don't think for me its worth the $600 for me. Especially with an F80 M3 in 7 months I'll have enough to play with then(and tune )

In that sense you should've gotten the 35D as DD and M3 for the fun stuff!

[r33_RGSport]

Originally Posted by BKMK5

Standard 19" rims. The Cayenne S had 19s and handled a bit better in corners and had steel springs as well. For the little amount of money for the gains you get, the tunes are great. Just with the way the truck is setup (suspension and brakes) I don't think for me its worth the $600 for me. Especially with an F80 M3 in 7 months I'll have enough to play with then(and tune )

Is that the wait time for the M3? I did install BMS JB4 on M4 last week, and test drove the car before and after. I cried happily. I just unleashed the greatest beast on the BMW S55 motor.
Made me wanted to get M3/M4.

[opasha]

Ok, so I plugged the tune back in with S2=A. Here's what I noticed first. No CEL. I decided to drive and test how it feels and went to my grocery store nearby about 7 minutes away. The setting with A instead of B is very different - the throttle lags a lot perhaps even worse than stock or about the same. I definitely don't like this setting. I went to the store and came back 20 minutes or so later. Started the car, and the CEL returned. I called Paul of RaceChip back up and he told me to send him pics of the install, which I just did. He told me to put the dummy plug back in. I did and cleared the CEL. He said to drive with the dummy plug for a while (not sure how long) to see if the CEL returns with this to make sure the harness isn't bad. @42pilot, patience is definitely going to be a virture, lol. Any tips or pointers? He wanted to see the install before suggesting any other settings since I asked what to try next. I guess he really wants to know if the harness is the cause or not. Any advice is appreciated. I really liked the chip with S2=B. It felt like a monster.

[opasha]

So, this is confusing. This was Paul's response after I sent the installation pics I showed you guys above:

"Hello Omar,

This location would be incorrect. Please see the attached picture. The wiring harness goes into the sensors at the intercooler towards the front of the engine.


Thanks
Paul"

He attached this image, which doesn't really look like the F15 5.0i but may be similar?:



Any thoughts? I told him the first installation didn't work with the connection he is showing. I used the 4720 plug (TMAP red plugs) for that and it put the car into low power mode with drivetrain malfunction and CEL. The 8720 plug however works by plugging into the same location as the BMS tune. Also, the 4720 plug is MUCH deeper and longer than the 8720 plug, which is why the 4720 did not fit into the the TMAP plugs that Paul is showing and only work in the MAF sensor area that bluelodge400 installed his tune into.

4720 (TMAP) vs 8720 (MAF) plug:

[42pilot]

Originally Posted by X5Jouster

honestly if these tunes help at all with the throttle mapping and throttle lag, i know not directly but indirectly, i would love it!

i feel intense lag and afterthought on part of the throttle for quick application. it does not want to go as soon as i want it to, like it cant handle the immediate power without distributing it to the wheels properly. i know we dont have a ton of turbo lag, but the throttle mapping or torque application is lacking

Don't look for these boxes to alter lag that much (unless it's a diesel whereby dumping fuel at a specific point in the combustion cycle does the trick). For a gas car, you need to alter ignition timing and these things don't do that. I would bet the gas box alters fuel delivery and waste gate (therefore altering boost).

Spooling a turbo faster is done by creating as much exhaust gas as fast as possible - ignition timing (advance the hell out of it) and CORRECT fueling (too much will put the fire out).

I am surprised your 4.6L V8 is laggy. My 550i had nearly the same motor (a few ponies less cause it was an '11), and there was no lag. That's why BMW installed two smaller turbo's rather than one big one or two sequentially. In addition, BMW has a great design to put the exhaust and turbo's in the center of the engine (down the valley) to all but eliminate lag. To prove that, the motor provides nearly peak torque at 1700-ish RPM. That's freakishly good.

[42pilot]

Originally Posted by X5Jouster

i concur. the msport 50i is wicked fast for an SUV, very stable through corners and flat lines on banks. very happy with the fast paced agility of the SUV.

i have the full suspension checklist with every option able upgrade.

at speeds over 80, i am unimpressed. we have a strip of road here in south Florida (CLosed Course)(sure........) and its is straight but not flat. kind of undulating hills like little ripples on water. on a bike its a breeze, in my audi s6 it was just fine.
i know its an suv but this thing was all over the place, correction after correction, there was no head on with the steering wheel, very involved to keep it inline. way too much steering wheel input needed to stay on target

still would love a tune and expect on purchasing one lol

Mine is rock solid even past 100 - I have the M package. No drift, no float and goes where I point it. The same car we drive is driven on the autobahn at much higher sustained speeds. But you are right - this is a 5,000 SUV and not a sports car for the twisties.

[X5Jouster]

Originally Posted by 42pilot

Don't look for these boxes to alter lag that much (unless it's a diesel whereby dumping fuel at a specific point in the combustion cycle does the trick). For a gas car, you need to alter ignition timing and these things don't do that. I would bet the gas box alters fuel delivery and waste gate (therefore altering boost).

Spooling a turbo faster is done by creating as much exhaust gas as fast as possible - ignition timing (advance the hell out of it) and CORRECT fueling (too much will put the fire out).

I am surprised your 4.6L V8 is laggy. My 550i had nearly the same motor (a few ponies less cause it was an '11), and there was no lag. That's why BMW installed two smaller turbo's rather than one big one or two sequentially. In addition, BMW has a great design to put the exhaust and turbo's in the center of the engine (down the valley) to all but eliminate lag. To prove that, the motor provides nearly peak torque at 1700-ish RPM. That's freakishly good.

Not necessarily the engine laggi ng or turbos at all. The engine is responsive but the power to the ground is delayed. I could almost floor it and get lag of power. Like a torque converter slowly applyingg the power

[opasha]

Originally Posted by X5Jouster

Not necessarily the engine laggi ng or turbos at all. The engine is responsive but the power to the ground is delayed. I could almost floor it and get lag of power. Like a torque converter slowly applyingg the power

This is exactly right. There's a slight delay in eco-pro and comfort modes in this manner where the engine is all ready to go and give power but it takes a second for the wheels to realize they have to go when the throttle is pushed down. @42pilot, you'd have to drive the 5.0i each day to really understand what X5Jouster and I are talking about. I know a few other 5.0i members noted the same feeling. This is what got me on the RaceChip idea in the first place.

[42pilot]

Originally Posted by X5Jouster

i have the upgraded M 20 inchers....they ride well but i would absolutely agree that 22s would tighten everything up. i can see what you mean.. im extremely happy with every aspect of the handling less the high speed straight line stabilization

Big tires and wheels kill handling. That's why Formula 1 still uses 13 in wheels and tires - eliminate as much rotating and unsprung mass as possible. In July, some teams tested 18 in wheels and the drivers thought the cars were dangerous.

Now if you plan to go in a straight line, big ass wheels and tires are stable BECAUSE they have rotating mass - think gyroscope. Spin those tires fast and they'll stay stable in one direction if properly installed and balanced. Try to turn them quickly though and you have a hand full of crap - no turn-in.

Then if you want a nice ride (tighten up as you put it), you'll need a bigger, tuned suspension to absorb and dampen those huge meats tires/wheels (an increase in unsprung mass). If the shocks aren't adaptive or aren't big enough to handle the job, the springs and wheels/tires will overwhelm and you'll float merrily down the road.

Then, think about the additional work of the brakes trying to stop all that additional rotating mass. It's a rabbit hole when talking about putting big wheels and tires on cars. But I guess they gotta look good...

[42pilot]

Originally Posted by X5Jouster

Not necessarily the engine laggi ng or turbos at all. The engine is responsive but the power to the ground is delayed. I could almost floor it and get lag of power. Like a torque converter slowly applyingg the power

That's completely possible since TC's are managed electronically. Does the engine rev or start to come up to speed before it starts moving? It sounds like a comfort feature to tame the motor. That sucks...

It would be interesting to know when the torque converter locks (what RPM) in each of the settings (ECO, comfort, sport). I know for a fact that my 35d locks up around 1000 rpm in sport (versus 1200 slip in comfort) which gives the feeling that the car has "more" power. It doesn't - it's just how it's applied. The chip adds the power.

For you, hopefully the chip manages the TC strategy too.

[r33_RGSport]

Originally Posted by opasha

So, this is confusing. This was Paul's response after I sent the installation pics I showed you guys above:

"Hello Omar,

This location would be incorrect. Please see the attached picture. The wiring harness goes into the sensors at the intercooler towards the front of the engine.


Thanks
Paul"

He attached this image, which doesn't really look like the F15 5.0i but may be similar?:



Any thoughts? I told him the first installation didn't work with the connection he is showing. I used the 4720 plug (TMAP red plugs) for that and it put the car into low power mode with drivetrain malfunction and CEL. The 8720 plug however works by plugging into the same location as the BMS tune. Also, the 4720 plug is MUCH deeper and longer than the 8720 plug, which is why the 4720 did not fit into the the TMAP plugs that Paul is showing and only work in the MAF sensor area that bluelodge400 installed his tune into.

4720 (TMAP) vs 8720 (MAF) plug:

Looks like Racechip still thinking that F15 5.0 motor is the old N63 motor.
Don't ever plug in the way he recommended, as you have damaged the sensor and got away with it.
Man, I was hoping that you got it sorted out already.

[opasha]

Originally Posted by r33

Looks like Racechip still thinking that F15 5.0 motor is the old N63 motor.
Don't ever plug in the way he recommended, as you have damaged the sensor and got away with it.
Man, I was hoping that you got it sorted out already.

Yeah, but I guess I'm gonna have to be patient and see what happens. He didn't respond to me after I replied back explaining the two situations regarding the two types of installations and each plug difference. The CEL went away with the dummy plug, and I drove the car pretty fast in an open road with no one around just to see if the harness would cause any issues. None. No CEL, so I know that the MAF sensor plug install can't be incorrect, especially if the BMS install is done this way, otherwise, how could the RaceChip activate properly with this setup and the CEL go away with the dummy plug? Makes no sense. I'm guessing RaceChip didn't study the 5.0i engine as deeply as they should have? No offense or anger here, but why create a separate harness that works with a MAF sensor and send it to me if only the TMAP is the way to install?

[BKMK5]

Originally Posted by cy07

In that sense you should've gotten the 35D as DD and M3 for the fun stuff!

So here how I ended up with a 50i and not by choice. I had the Mercedes GL for a few months when my au pair quit and went back to Germany. Well there wasn't any reason to be driving around a gas guzzler with 3 rows and all i'm transporting is my wife and 2 kids (1 and 2 year olds).

So in April of this year I put the GL up on SwapALease and got a guy who wanted it and we went through all the paperwork. I placed an order for a fully loaded 35i M Sport in Mineral White, Mocha Nappa with the leather dash and yada yada yada. Sure enough several weeks goes by and the guy finds out that he'd have to pay tax on the lease even though I've already rolled my taxes into the lease. Well he backs out and subsequently I have to back out of the X5. The X5 was ordered on 4/30, arrived at the dealer on 5/23 and then sat on the lot until the weekend of 6/14(found out the hard way).

Well my GL was parked in the street on 6/20 and a drunk driver doing 80MPH(cops estimated) hit my GL head on and his MDX flipped. Well my GL was totaled and the very next day I go to BMW thinking my preordered X5 that was sitting on the lot for 3 weeks would still be there. Well by the 4th week on the lot it was sold! You could only imagine the elation I had watching the tow truck driver tow my car away knowing I had my 'dream' truck(not really dream truck but you know what I mean) waiting for me at the dealer, only to find out it was SOLD! Well I couldn't order a 2014 X5 any longer and I couldn't wait till now to be receiving a 2015 by the end of August beginning of September, I had to look on the lots. Well there were very few M Sports and the 35i M Sports that were available were bare bones. I wasn't going to buy or lease a car I wasn't happy with the specs. The only alternative I has was to take an X5 50i and make concessions like the leather dash and door trim I really wanted or the LED headlights.

Originally Posted by r33

Is that the wait time for the M3? I did install BMS JB4 on M4 last week, and test drove the car before and after. I cried happily. I just unleashed the greatest beast on the BMW S55 motor.
Made me wanted to get M3/M4.

No thats not the wait for the M3s, but I plan on doing another Euro delivery for another M3. My wifes G37x goes back next June so if I do an ED the middle/end of April, go for a 7 day trip and visit the Spa in Belgium and the Nurburgring (bucket list stuff) and then ship the car back I'll have it in time to replace the G37. And at that time the wife gets the X5(another reason not to tune the X5) and I'll have the M3. I'll surely be tuning the M3 once it gets back here. 510HP and 522ft/lb at the wheels is amazing for an M3.

Turbos + Tunes =

[42pilot]

Originally Posted by BKMK5

510HP and 522ft/lb at the wheels is amazing for an M3.

Turbos + Tunes =

Those are numbers at the rear wheels??? That's over 575 at the crank with 12% power train loss. Do you have a dyno sheet for that? I would love to see where that makes power in the RPM's.

[r33_RGSport]

Here it is.
My buttdyno was about right at the 500whp.

&amp;#9600;&amp;#9604; eas | EAS M4 enters the 500whp club - JB4 Stage 3 testing: 521whp/540ft-lb tq. http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1031990" rel="" target="_blank">http://<a href="http://f80.bimmerpos...?t=1031990</a>

[Alan l.]

My 550 has the N63TU motor which should be the same as the F15 5.0 motor (just different covers) and my engine has those sensors on there. Burger tuning originally sold me a tune using those sensors for my car but later on told me that the tune wasn't effective anymore tapping to those. It was fine for the old N63 but for the TU bmw changed something so he revised the TU tune using the MAF sensors instead.

Originally Posted by opasha

So, this is confusing. This was Paul's response after I sent the installation pics I showed you guys above:

"Hello Omar,

This location would be incorrect. Please see the attached picture. The wiring harness goes into the sensors at the intercooler towards the front of the engine.


Thanks
Paul"

He attached this image, which doesn't really look like the F15 5.0i but may be similar?:



Any thoughts? I told him the first installation didn't work with the connection he is showing. I used the 4720 plug (TMAP red plugs) for that and it put the car into low power mode with drivetrain malfunction and CEL. The 8720 plug however works by plugging into the same location as the BMS tune. Also, the 4720 plug is MUCH deeper and longer than the 8720 plug, which is why the 4720 did not fit into the the TMAP plugs that Paul is showing and only work in the MAF sensor area that bluelodge400 installed his tune into.

4720 (TMAP) vs 8720 (MAF) plug:

[bluelodge400]

42pilot,
You seem to be a wealth of knowledge on the N63tu engine. I was hoping you could explain how the BMS Tune might work? Since it only attaches to the MAF sensor, does it only increase the air fuel ratio?
Since nothing connects to the ECU or TMAP does it not change any of the settings that would give the vehicle even more power.

I can’t imagine a few wires connected through a 2” x 1” chip would make that many adjustments to the engine.