Thoughts on Used x5

[Habs11]

Would like to know your thoughts on a few things.

1) I'm at the point now where I've decided I want a used X5 x35i - likely 2014 or 2015 based on my price point. Many dealers seem to be around $40K - $45K asking price (CPO, reasonable miles,- clean carfax). My belief is the value is about $37K depending on options - I am going to wait until my perfect match shows up at my price point within 500 miles of my home. My question is . . . did anyone else buy used this way? (specifically setting a target price and waiting for it)

2) Anyone else done comprehensive research and think my value of $37 is reasonable or not?

3) Lets say a 2014 was leased with MSRP of $60K and residual of .57. The residual price is $34.2K - isn't it reasonable that a dealer could sell for $34.2 plus $2,000 or $2,500 to give them some profit and costs to run it through their shop?

4) Wholesale auction price for my hypothetical vehicle is about $33K. I'm thinking auction fees, transport and shop/detail fees would be about $3K so a $37K sell price leaves the dealer $1,000 profit.

Besides the obvious - a car is worth what you are willing to pay for it - what do you guys think about my reasoning? All the above is how I'm getting to my price of about $37.

[ronmexico385]

We bought my wife's 2014 sdrive35i 6 months ago after a couple
Months of looking with a similar criteria: we were looking for a 2014 luxury line cpo with <40k miles for around 40k. Ended up getting our top color choice (mineral white/mocha), and a bunch of other options we didn't really need but are nice to have (HK, 3rd row/rear air, running boards, soft close doors, etc.) I think the original sticker was 64.

Based on the few months I spent looking half a year ago, I'd say your target is ambitious but do-able, if you get lucky or are willing to wait long enough, or if you are content with a base/minimally optioned vehicle.

[eggyacid]

That's exactly what I did.

I wanted a particular option/trim and wasn't willing to settle since I have another car to drive.
I found the one CPO with 100K warranty after about 3 months then negotiate my price.

I found many XLine and Luxury line, even SDrive for about $38K but doesn't have all the options I want. So price seems right

[shmohawk]

You're approaching your search perfectly. I recently purchased a CPO '14 X5d with M Sport and searched the same way. I was specifically looking for a diesel with M Sport trim so my prices were prob a little higher than the gasser but with $40 - 45k you will find what you're looking for. I came across one fully loaded 35i that almost made me switch to gas but I decided to hold off, it basically had every option except for 3rd row and entertainment I believe and was listed at $46,900, though had been sitting on the lot for 3+ months so this is prob not the norm. $37k might be a little aggressive but don't know all your requirements and I only searched diesels.

Might want to expand your search a little too. I have checked back on listings though I know I shouldn't, and the stock seems stale around me. Luckily I was able to find one inside 500 mi but I would have traveled farther.

One thing that sucks is I noticed the BMW CPO site must have been redesigned and where before you could bookmark your search as filters were in the URL, this has been removed and you need to filter every time you go to the site now

[Habs11]

Awesome feedback guys thanks. IMO I will have to wait to find the perfect match..... I'm trying to guess how long the wait will be. For example - if prices on used decrease $5,000 per year that's about $400 per month (these I made up). What I'm getting to is my hypothetical vehicle might be out of my price point today but in 5 months it won't be and I'm think in 5 months from now there will be another coming off lease that suits my needs.

Another thing is I'm getting close to telling my local sales guy my price point and options. I thinking at some point I make an offer on a unit and when they balk I just say I'll call back next week with the same offer.... essentially letting them know my price and waiting for it to happen.

I also will likely buy an extended warranty - maybe that's a convo for another thread (and I have yet to search) but IMO a vehicle with 25,000 miles I don't need it yet and can buy in the future but if it has 45,000 when I purchase I'll want it. So I need to balance CPO Vs extended warranty.

[P1]

The way you're going about this is spot on. I wanted an example with higher-end options, so my search took a bit longer. If you simply want an M Sport, those are easy to come by. But Nappa Leather, ACC, LED headlights, all the active driver packages, those will make your search take a bit longer. They also won't be $37K either!

Mine came from Atlanta, so I had to get shipping arranged. Would do it again in a heartbeat.

[jeostang]

I just bought my wife's 2015 MSport xdrive with 25k miles, just about fully loaded, for 44k. Get friendly with a few service guys, the ones that look over the trade ins, have them let you know when a trade to your liking is in the shop. Then see if you can deal with the owners.

[P1]

Originally Posted by jeostang

I just bought my wife's 2015 MSport xdrive with 25k miles, just about fully loaded, for 44k.

What do you consider "fully loaded"? I see, for example, you don't have LED headlights to start off with.

[Florida-X3]

We just got a 2014 X5 x35i with 38k miles, CPO for 38k. I think they started asking at 43k. iDrive Pro, back-up camera, cold weather package, hitch (with electrical), good tires, etc.

[jeostang]

Originally Posted by P1et

What do you consider "fully loaded"? I see, for example, you don't have LED headlights to start off with.

Yeah said "just about", yep no lighting package.

Here is the options

Selection Cop Relevant Vehicles
Black Sapphire Metallic - 475
Leder Dakota/schwarz - LCSW
20"m Lt/aly Wheels Double Sp. 469m/
Sport Automatic Transmission
Tyre Pressure Indicator
Steering Column Adjustment Elec
Backup Camera
Without Additional Designation Outs
Ind.roof Rails High-gloss Shadow L
Integrated Universal Remote Control
Comfort Access System
M Sport Package
Fine-wood Trim Poplar Grain
Aut.air Conditioning 4-zone Control
Blow-by-heater
Sun Protection Glazing
Floor Mats, Velour
Int/ext Rr Vw Mirror W Aut Anti-dazzle
Smokers Package
Active Seat Ventilation, Front
Comfort Seats, Electric. Adjustable
Lumbar Support Driver/front Passenger
Storage Compartment Package
Seat Heating F Driver/front Passenger
Lane Change Warning
Driving Assistant
Led-fog Lights
Surround View
Park Distance Control (pdc)
Lights Package
Additional 12v Power Socket
Intelligent Emergency Call
Teleservices
Connecteddrive Services
Real Time Traffic Information
Remote Services
Navigation System Professional
Head Up Display
Satellite Radio
Harman/kardon Surround Sound System
Area-code 1
M Leather Steering Wheel
M Aerodynamics Package
Individual High-gloss Satin Chrome
Individual Roof-lining Anthracite
Oelserviceint. 15.000km/11months
Decoding Variable Light Distributio
Speed Limit Info
Daytime Driving Lights Selectable B
High Speed Synchronisation
External Skin Protection
adaptive m suspension

[jeostang]

I was looking at this one, had them down to 41500, then they went back up to 42000. Wasn't happy with that tactic. Really wanted it for 40k, but they were not budging.

http://www.bmwofsilverspring.com/cer...f3bcb4ccb3.htm

[P1]

Originally Posted by jeostang

Yeah said "just about", yep no lighting package.

Here is the options

Selection Cop Relevant Vehicles
Black Sapphire Metallic - 475
Leder Dakota/schwarz - LCSW
20"m Lt/aly Wheels Double Sp. 469m/
Sport Automatic Transmission
Tyre Pressure Indicator
Steering Column Adjustment Elec
Backup Camera
Without Additional Designation Outs
Ind.roof Rails High-gloss Shadow L
Integrated Universal Remote Control
Comfort Access System
M Sport Package
Fine-wood Trim Poplar Grain
Aut.air Conditioning 4-zone Control
Blow-by-heater
Sun Protection Glazing
Floor Mats, Velour
Int/ext Rr Vw Mirror W Aut Anti-dazzle
Smokers Package
Active Seat Ventilation, Front
Comfort Seats, Electric. Adjustable
Lumbar Support Driver/front Passenger
Storage Compartment Package
Seat Heating F Driver/front Passenger
Lane Change Warning
Driving Assistant
Led-fog Lights
Surround View
Park Distance Control (pdc)
Lights Package
Additional 12v Power Socket
Intelligent Emergency Call
Teleservices
Connecteddrive Services
Real Time Traffic Information
Remote Services
Navigation System Professional
Head Up Display
Satellite Radio
Harman/kardon Surround Sound System
Area-code 1
M Leather Steering Wheel
M Aerodynamics Package
Individual High-gloss Satin Chrome
Individual Roof-lining Anthracite
Oelserviceint. 15.000km/11months
Decoding Variable Light Distributio
Speed Limit Info
Daytime Driving Lights Selectable B
High Speed Synchronisation
External Skin Protection
adaptive m suspension

You'll find we're sensitive to "fully loaded" here. Things like LED headlights, nappa leather, B&O, night vision, active cruise control, leather dashboard, DHP, ceramic controls, rear sear heaters, rear adjustable seats, rear privacy shades and 21" performance wheels would be considered "fully loaded".

Regardless, nice X5 and enjoy in good health...

[jeostang]

Originally Posted by P1et

You'll find we're sensitive to "fully loaded" here. Things like LED headlights, nappa leather, B&O, night vision, active cruise control, leather dashboard, DHP, ceramic controls, rear sear heaters, rear adjustable seats, rear privacy shades and 21" performance wheels would be considered "fully loaded".

Regardless, nice X5 and enjoy in good health...

Your right my bad.

[smooveken]

just for comparison sake, i got the following price:

CPO 2015 x5 35d (bought it in 2016, so 1 year old)
2k miles only
no line
nappa leather upgrade
HUD
Back up camera
running boards
rear window pull up sun shades

before tax: 49k

[P1]

Originally Posted by jeostang

Your right my bad.

jiggz is who we rely on for this!

[jiggz]

Originally Posted by P1et

jiggz is who we rely on for this!

LOL


I think you've got the F15 stuff down better than me.

[lectoid]

I'm at the same point where OP is. Looking for a used X5 in the low 40's.

My main criteria is a 3rd row.

[P1]

Originally Posted by lectoid

I'm at the same point where OP is. Looking for a used X5 in the low 40's.

My main criteria is a 3rd row.

Get on cars.com, and start pulling VIN numbers. If you want specific options, you're likely going to have it be shipped to you. I've shipped three cars to Europe and had my X5 brought to from Georgia via a flatbed. Absolutely zero issues.

[lectoid]

Originally Posted by P1et

Get on cars.com, and start pulling VIN numbers. If you want specific options, you're likely going to have it be shipped to you. I've shipped three cars to Europe and had my X5 brought to from Georgia via a flatbed. Absolutely zero issues.

Using the BMW CPO search thing, there are usually about 30-33 vehicles within a 250 mile radius.

I just went to that site and it's changed and seems broken. X6's are coming up when I select the 3rd row option.

[P1]

Originally Posted by lectoid

Using the BMW CPO search thing, there are usually about 30-33 vehicles within a 250 mile radius.

I just went to that site and it's changed and seems broken. X6's are coming up when I select the 3rd row option.

I don't find the BMW CPO search to be very good, and have never relied on it. Don't only search for CPO vehicles: if you find the one you want, and it's priced right with the right options but doesn't have CPO, then just buy the BMW Gold warranty and you'll have the same coverage.

[lectoid]

On cars.com, I don't see a way to specify 3rd row as an option, and I don't trust searching for it as a keyword or whatever.

I guess I have to get a list of VIN's in my price range and then decode them.

That was one advantage of the CPO search.

[Flying Ace]

your estimate is logically sound. Good job. You're one of the few people that understands you need to look at both lease residual values and wholesale auction values to get a rough estimate.

The only thing you have to mixed up are wholesale related fees, and the amounts are material. In your analysis you uniformly assigned $2500 to wholesale, but I think, it depends on whether dealer got it at auction or got it as lease return. If you are buying it from a dealer, you need to add in about $1000 for transport/auction fees. (in wholesale market, the selling dealer pays auction fee for selling, and the buying dealer pays transport fees to pick up the car, which all account for about $1000 each on both sides). Generally, Manheim doesn't take ownership nor is it a custodian of the car itself, they're simply a pricing/clearing/financing agent. Then you need to add a small premium for dealer profit.

So if it was a lease return, they will let it go for a cheaper bottom line as their "buyer of last resort" is average auction price + auction fee of about $1000. If they acquired it at auction, it'll be average auction price + $1000 transport + profit margin, a bit more expensive.

Also CPO adds about $2.5k "invoice" cost to a BMW dealer's pricing. Once CPO'd they can't take it off. But it's worth asking whether their price already reflects work performed for CPO. I've noticed some dealers advertise the car is CPO but haven't performed CPO work on it and haven't sunk money into PPI, cosmetic fixes and tires, so they'll take CPO off for cheaper pricing, but you have to ASK!

It just shows that buying from a private party is best, as their trade in offers from the dealer usually is a discount to average wholesale pricing.

Finally, I just learn a new "off-the-grid" wholesale market. They are run by the major manufacturers themselves (BMW/MB/Ford) so they don't pay an exchange fee to Manheim. Before they attempt to list their cars on the national wholesale exchanges, they actually run their own private market wholesale exchange. Participants on their own exchange are dealers within their own network (all other BMW dealers for example), and some select major 3rd party dealers (CarMax). And pricing here is opaque to us. I have yet to get a print out of these auction history clearing sheets, but based on a guy who participates (he works for a 3rd party dealer), he said often they don't clear much more than their opening bid price (meaning often there's only 1 bid put in per car, and I get the sense that there are often many cars that don't even get a bid). If you find anymore info on how to get pricing on this, let me know. I found out highly valued and sought M cars clear on this exchange rather than Manheim. Ultimately the pricing on this private exchange still tracts in line with Manheim + associated fees bc otherwise it'll create arbitrage opportunities. The main purpose of it is so dealers within the same network don't pay exchange fees to a 3rd party.

Anyways you figured it out, you now know how the sausage is made. Don't be surprised by next week, all of us who have read this will be murdered by goons.