CPO accident cover up

[eldogo]

So I purchased a CPO 2016 F15 in May for Passport BMW in Maryland. It had a clean Carfax and everything looked good. Fast forward this week, I took my car to another dealership, BMW of Silver Spring for the MPPK install, and the SA calls me saying that the tech has found a few signs that the vehicle was in an accident prior my purchase.

They found that the hood is misaligned, the driver side headlight was glue on, the driver side door is slightly rubbing on the fender and paint is chipping, the bumper has paint run off on some sections.

I called Passport BMW and they asked me to bring it over so that the used cars manager can see it. The manager ended up saying that they will fix all those issues and replace the headlight.

I know that I should have caught all this, but my wife wanted it so bad so i didn't inspect it as i usually would and besides its a CPO... what could be wrong with it.

What are your thoughts? They didn’t disclose it. I have reached out to a few legal people for their advice on my next move.

[RED_Y_]

Personally- I would try to return the vehicle, unless price was really good and they are willing to fix and replace everything. Not sure how legit it is from BMWNA point to CPO car after an accident, I would call their hotline and asked.

[Chigger]

Man, that is shady. I agree with RED_Y and return it if possible.

Or lawyer up?

[turboawd]

I was told a bmw can still be sold as cpo even with accident history.

[eldogo]

Originally Posted by turboawd

I was told a bmw can still be sold as cpo even with accident history.

Mmh, interesting.

[smyles]

Squeeze some freebies from them and move on. CPO never guaranteed no accidents.

[The Libertine]

Originally Posted by smyles

Squeeze some freebies from them and move on. CPO never guaranteed no accidents.

I’m inclined to agree; however, based on the fact the selling dealer is amenable to doing a proper repair would not press the issue. Perhaps one (or two) complimentary oil changes, or some BMW swag, for your inconvenience and upset.

[BimmerX5kid]

its not a cover up.. its called the "Carfax is no upside only downside for the consumer." I've seen this happen two times. A person bought a clean carfax car.. then subsequently found out later the car was in an accident. In one case the newly run Carfax still showed no accident. In the 2nd case the accident did show up on the newly run carfax. He wanted to sue the seller (dealer), but the dealer still had a copy of the Carfax from the sale, and the accident had not been reported on that one. In both cases the buyer got nothing.

Carfax only is advantageous to the dealer. If you are a seller and the dealer sees the accident you are screwed. Yet you as a buyer do not get any UPSIDE from a Carfax you only bear the risk of the downside if its incorrect.

[RED_Y_]

Originally Posted by turboawd

I was told a bmw can still be sold as cpo even with accident history.

Originally Posted by smyles

Squeeze some freebies from them and move on. CPO never guaranteed no accidents.

I think you both are correct, but there are 2 problems. Number one- dealer did not disclose the damage, just provided the CarFax. Number two- CPO means that vehicle was properly inspected and re-conditioned. When I was buying my X5 even the CarFax was clean they made me sign a piece of paper confirming that the bumper cover was replaced and re-painted due to the shopping cart damage, so I was fully aware of what was done.

From BMW CPO site

Before each BMW can receive the distinction of being Certified and fully backed by BMW of North America, LLC they must be thoroughly inspected, reconditioned and approved by a BMW inspection team of BMW trained technicians, Service Managers and Pre-Owned Managers. This ensures that your BMW Certified vehicle delivers the genuine Ultimate Driving Machine® experience you demand.



They must pass an extensive examination and inspection by BMW factory-trained technicians. They inspect the vehicle for safety, performance and wear. If something is not right, it is fixed. If it cannot be fixed, the vehicle cannot become BMW Certified.

In short, we're picky. But when you see everything covered under our Protection Plan, you'll understand why.

So the dealership failed the inspection and reconditioning process or actually was aware of the problem but did not notify the customer. One way or another- looks shady to me. Especially when it doesn't sound like a bumper scratch. Replaced (re-painted) hood,fender, bumper and damaged headlight? Who knows what else they're hiding.

[smyles]

Nowhere in the description it mentions accidents. A misaligned hood isn't a safety concern. Now, if they had direct knowledge of an accident but replied 'no' when OP asked about any, than it's a fraud. Otherwise, just poor service, and seems like they atempt to make it right (within what they consider reasonable).

Re Carfax, I wouldn't bash it other than being unreasonably expensive for an occasional user; it's still better than no report at all. It obviously cannot list an accident if someone wasn't attentive during parking and subsequently fixed the damage on his driveway, that's where buyer's due diligence kicks in.

[RED_Y_]

Originally Posted by smyles

Nowhere in the description it mentions accidents. A misaligned hood isn't a safety concern. Now, if they had direct knowledge of an accident but replied 'no' when OP asked about any, than it's a fraud. Otherwise, just poor service, and seems like they atempt to make it right (within what they consider reasonable).

Re Carfax, I wouldn't bash it other than being unreasonably expensive for an occasional user; it's still better than no report at all. It obviously cannot list an accident if someone wasn't attentive during parking and subsequently fixed the damage on his driveway, that's where buyer's due diligence kicks in.

Right, it doesn't but it says about inspection. So selling dealership missed misaligned hood, fender, headlight glued together? Yes, misaligned hood is not a safety concern but if they missed that, who knows what else did they miss (or did not mention).

[smyles]

I dunno. Have you checked the paint depth of all elements? Stamped dates on various plastic parts, esp. front driver side? Airbag status?

[eldogo]

Originally Posted by smyles

I dunno. Have you checked the paint depth of all elements? Stamped dates on various plastic parts, esp. front driver side? Airbag status?

I haven't checked the paint depth and all. But I've asked them to also do a safety inspection so that I have it on file just incase something happens.

[turboawd]

Don't let it get to you too much. Cars get hit and repaired every day. As long as the dealer will make the repairs, you should be good.
And don't ever trust carfax in the future. A lot of states don't report their accidents. Sometimes you might need to do an autocheck report as well, cause sometimes they might show an accident that carfax doesn't.

[P1]

Agree with the above posts. Last I remember, a CPO can have up to three panels replaced before it's no longer a CPO. So a fender, a hood and a door for example.

But I could drive my X5 into a lamp post, and call my buddy who owns a bodyshop and have it be repaired without an insurance company or CarFax ever finding out about it. And why not, it's perfectly legal to do that.

[sj22]

Originally Posted by P1et

But I could drive my X5 into a lamp post, and call my buddy who owns a bodyshop and have it be repaired without an insurance company or CarFax ever finding out about it. And why not, it's perfectly legal to do that.

This.

I would advise OP to ask the original dealer for their cpo inspection report.

[menelaos]

Carfax is junk, it seems.
They only capture major events consistently, i. e, salvage titles etc

[eldogo]

Thank you all for the responses.

I'll go through the fixes the dealership has offered and also ask for their cpo inspection report.

The good thing is that nothing else is wrong with the car in regards to how it drives. I've gone on one road trip with confidence. No shakes or wobbles.

I'll keep y'all posted.

[artem123]

I find it strange, and almost hard to believe, that the fact that door rubbing the fender to the point that pain chips, is unnoticed since May.

[eldogo]

Originally Posted by artem123

I find it strange, and almost hard to believe, that the fact that door rubbing the fender to the point that pain chips, is unnoticed since May.

Here is the chip.

[gqgambler]

Nothing wrong with the Carfax and its not ironclad. Carfax only captures REPORTED accidents through specific sources. From their website....
"* Do CARFAX Vehicle History Reports have information about accidents?
Yes. If an accident has been reported to CARFAX it will be included in the CARFAX Vehicle History Report. CARFAX reports have information about accidents in all 50 states, the District of Columbia and Canada. We guarantee we will have information about the most severe accidents, ones for which the states or provinces have issued a branded title. We also have the largest publicly accessible database of less severe accidents which we have compiled from thousands of sources.
However, we do not have all accidents as many have never been reported, or may only have been reported to a source to which CARFAX does not have access. We recommend that any car be inspected by a qualified mechanic prior to purchase to make sure the vehicle is functioning properly and check for signs of unreported damage."

So just because a car has a clean CARFAX doesn't mean it hasn't been in an accident. CARFAX is most useful for major accidents and title issues. Minor repairs may never hit a CARFAX, but many people assume that CARFAX encompasses all accidents.

Issue is with the dealer and they should have seen some of these issues on inspections. Its shady if they choose not to address them or repair them, but not necessary illegal although you could argue for fraud. If they have no proof of an accident it is only suspicion that there was one and a repair could have been done for a variety of reasons, not only a car accident; such as previous owner repaired a shopping cart ding or scrapped fender that encompassed no deep damage. The list can go on and on for example. Dealers don't want to spend anymore money than they have to make a car sellable; all it need to do is look good and pass inspections. And CPO cars can have minor accidents; the quality of the repair will impact its eligibility though.

[gqgambler]

Originally Posted by eldogo

Here is the chip.

That chip is easy to ignore and not required to be repaired.