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      10-12-2017, 10:37 PM   #1
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Question What is the difference between the M Sport Exhaust and the M Performance Exhaust?

Hi,

I am buying the Genuine BMW F15 X5 M Sport Aerodynamic Retrofit Kit from GetBMWparts.com for my 2014 X5 xDrive35 X-Linei.

This kit includes the M Sport Exhaust.

see this link:

https://getbmwparts.com/partlocator/...catalogid=4462



but I seem to be confused about something... What is the difference between the M Sport Exhaust and the M Performance Exhaust?



See the link for the M Performance Exhaust: (GetBMWparts.com is including the trapezoidal tips when you get this exhaust by itself).

https://getbmwparts.com/partlocator/...catalogid=4462




1) Is the M Sport Exhaust and the M Performance Exhaust one and the same?


2) If not, is there a difference between the x-Line exhaust vs the M Sport Exhaust vs the M Performance exhaust?




I need to place the order tomorrow (my car is sitting at the body shop waiting) so your input would be greatly appreciated.
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      10-13-2017, 12:06 AM   #2
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M Sport exhaust = Stock exhaust in terms of sound - all 35i come stock with same quiet exhaust. M Sport only adds some details like different tips (trapezoid shape instead of stock round ones, and possibly different finish like chrome, not sure), but it's same exhaust sound wise - same muffler.

M performance exhaust - is a different muffler that produces more growl and a bit deeper sound. It has different construction inside muffler. Again, I'm not sure with what tips it may come with, could be same tips as in M sport exhaust, but sound will be different because of different muffler.

So basically tips are trapezoid or round, they may be chrome or not, but it's essentially just cosmetics. Only M Performance exhaust does really change muffler itself and thus sound

Hope this helps. Also, keep in mind that order will take time to arrive (you said your car is sitting in the shop waiting)

P.S. Just a rant. Dropping a $4600 for a M Sport conversion kit is very brave, but imho there are options to just imrove the look of your stock non M Sport look and add M Performance parts. I would have rather bought Aero kit for non M Sport and bought M Performance exhaust and M performance brake kit - basically for almost same money you'll get better sound, better brakes and upgraded looks (not M Sport, but still good), just my 2c. End of rant

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      10-13-2017, 12:43 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DuSh View Post
M Sport exhaust = Stock exhaust in terms of sound - all 35i come stock with same quiet exhaust. M Sport only adds some details like different tips (trapezoid shape instead of stock round ones, and possibly different finish like chrome, not sure), but it's same exhaust sound wise - same muffler.

M performance exhaust - is a different muffler that produces more growl and a bit deeper sound. It has different construction inside muffler. Again, I'm not sure with what tips it may come with, could be same tips as in M sport exhaust, but sound will be different because of different muffler.

So basically tips are trapezoid or round, they may be chrome or not, but it's essentially just cosmetics. Only M Performance exhaust does really change muffler itself and thus sound

Hope this helps. Also, keep in mind that order will take time to arrive (you said your car is sitting in the shop waiting)

P.S. Just a rant. Dropping a $4600 for a M Sport conversion kit is very brave, but imho there are options to just imrove the look of your stock non M Sport look and add M Performance parts. I would have rather bought Aero kit for non M Sport and bought M Performance exhaust and M performance brake kit - basically for almost same money you'll get better sound, better brakes and upgraded looks (not M Sport, but still good), just my 2c. End of rant

Thanks for the info!

I'm kinda stuck getting the M Sport body and I have damaged my stock exhaust and bumper while backing up into a pole.

I also want to delete the running boards (I just don't like them personally) and buying x-line rocker panels, and getting a new rear bumper + replacing the exhaust comes out to roughly the same price as there is a price savings when getting the M sport retrofit kit which includes everything (Including exhaust and wheel flares).

So the only real "extra expense" is just the front bumper, plus installation and clear shield protection,

which I will offset by selling the mint condition other parts like the front bumper, running boards, and wheel flares (save the exhaust and rear bumper which are damaged on eBay).

Otherwise I would take your advice.


With the information that you gave me on the M Performance Exhaust, I looked at some video clips and it does seem a bit loud, and that makes me worry about droning while driving (droning drives me bananas).

1) Do you have any experience with the Performance exhaust?

2) I heard that they are not valve-tronic... is that true?

3)Would this require a different tune?

4) Or are my fears not really an issue?

5) Lastly, I noticed that the Msport body retrofit comes with 2 sets of lower bumper intakes inserts, I being faux, the other being half open. Do the half open ones provide any benefit, i.e. cooling, extra air into the engine, etc?
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      10-13-2017, 02:18 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marky Mark View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuSh View Post
M Sport exhaust = Stock exhaust in terms of sound - all 35i come stock with same quiet exhaust. M Sport only adds some details like different tips (trapezoid shape instead of stock round ones, and possibly different finish like chrome, not sure), but it's same exhaust sound wise - same muffler.

M performance exhaust - is a different muffler that produces more growl and a bit deeper sound. It has different construction inside muffler. Again, I'm not sure with what tips it may come with, could be same tips as in M sport exhaust, but sound will be different because of different muffler.

So basically tips are trapezoid or round, they may be chrome or not, but it's essentially just cosmetics. Only M Performance exhaust does really change muffler itself and thus sound

Hope this helps. Also, keep in mind that order will take time to arrive (you said your car is sitting in the shop waiting)

P.S. Just a rant. Dropping a $4600 for a M Sport conversion kit is very brave, but imho there are options to just imrove the look of your stock non M Sport look and add M Performance parts. I would have rather bought Aero kit for non M Sport and bought M Performance exhaust and M performance brake kit - basically for almost same money you'll get better sound, better brakes and upgraded looks (not M Sport, but still good), just my 2c. End of rant

Thanks for the info!

I'm kinda stuck getting the M Sport body and I have damaged my stock exhaust and bumper while backing up into a pole.

I also want to delete the running boards (I just don't like them personally) and buying x-line rocker panels, and getting a new rear bumper + replacing the exhaust comes out to roughly the same price as there is a price savings when getting the M sport retrofit kit which includes everything (Including exhaust and wheel flares).

So the only real "extra expense" is just the front bumper, plus installation and clear shield protection,

which I will offset by selling the mint condition other parts like the front bumper, running boards, and wheel flares (save the exhaust and rear bumper which are damaged on eBay).

Otherwise I would take your advice.


With the information that you gave me on the M Performance Exhaust, I looked at some video clips and it does seem a bit loud, and that makes me worry about droning while driving (droning drives me bananas).

1) Do you have any experience with the Performance exhaust?

2) I heard that they are not valve-tronic... is that true?

3)Would this require a different tune?

4) Or are my fears not really an issue?

5) Lastly, I noticed that the Msport body retrofit comes with 2 sets of lower bumper intakes inserts, I being faux, the other being half open. Do the half open ones provide any benefit, i.e. cooling, extra air into the engine, etc?
I think the aero kit is also more special as almost nobody has it, pleanty of msport around
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      10-13-2017, 09:49 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1230vani View Post
I think the aero kit is also more special as almost nobody has it, pleanty of msport around
Agreed, but I would still be left with the running boards with the Aero Kit. I know everybody likes the way the running boards look, but they just simply are not for me hence my opting for the M Sport body retrofit kit.

The M sport retrofit kit comes with an M Sport exhaust, which would lead me to believe that it is somehow different than what comes on non-M Sport X5's...

Unless the exhaust tips are welded on and that's the reason why they are selling it that way (i.e. as whole units) but that seems to be counter intuitive.

I don't have my car in my garage (it's at the body shop) so I can't confirm if the exhaust tips on that exhaust are removable or welded on.



1) Can anyone confirm if the tips are welded on by looking at their non M sport or M sport car?


Thanks
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      10-13-2017, 11:06 AM   #6
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MPE are removable, MSport are not (tips)
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      10-13-2017, 11:08 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Violator View Post
MPE are removable, MSport are not (tips)
Thanks!
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      10-13-2017, 11:13 AM   #8
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If you have an option, get the MPE, you won't regret it. Go ahead and add the MPPK to it while you're at it, they pair very nicely.
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      10-13-2017, 08:16 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DuSh View Post
M Sport exhaust = Stock exhaust in terms of sound - all 35i come stock with same quiet exhaust. M Sport only adds some details like different tips (trapezoid shape instead of stock round ones, and possibly different finish like chrome, not sure), but it's same exhaust sound wise - same muffler... ...
Thank you. Just curious. You mentioned 35i has the quiet exhaust. I agree it's not loud most of time, but I can hear about 10-seconds deep and growl sound out of the exhaust when the cold engine is started. I tried to duplicate that sound, but I'm never able to.

When the engine is fired, I recalled there are often people walking toward to the back of my car to see what I have. I said to them it's 35i without mod, and it only last 10-seconds.

Long story short, I guess our quiet 35i exhaust still has the potential structure insides to make the nice sound, but I just don't know how to replicate that sound.

Any ideas? Thanks.
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      10-13-2017, 09:26 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by retx View Post
Thank you. Just curious. You mentioned 35i has the quiet exhaust. I agree it's not loud most of time, but I can hear about 10-seconds deep and growl sound out of the exhaust when the cold engine is started. I tried to duplicate that sound, but I'm never able to.

When the engine is fired, I recalled there are often people walking toward to the back of my car to see what I have. I said to them it's 35i without mod, and it only last 10-seconds.

Long story short, I guess our quiet 35i exhaust still has the potential structure insides to make the nice sound, but I just don't know how to replicate that sound.

Any ideas? Thanks.
I'm not 100% sure, but I think that is a so called "cold start" mode that ECU initiates on cold starts for a short duration (around 10 sec like you said). It opens up wastegates to bypass turbos and let catalytic converters warm up faster - only needed on cold start ups. basically in that scenario all gases go directly into exhaust through cats warming them up and as a consequence creating a growl that you hear. In normal mode wastegate is closed to allow gases go through the turbo and spin it up creating boost.
What I'm wondering tho, is if we can electronically open wastegates from time to time to experience that nice growl?
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      10-14-2017, 02:43 AM   #11
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^ just step on the accelerate pedal harder to build boost? once boost target is hit, wastegate opens up. if there was a way to manually open the wastegate on demand, u'll have serious turbo lag when trying to accelerate... which is pretty dumb... and no, cold start does not open up the wastegate to bypass the turbine to warm up the cats quicker. the wastesgate is normally opened until u accelerate, so either way majority of the gas is bypassing the turbine already. the louder exhaust during cold start is due to a) the exhaust flap opening and b) the higher engine idle speed.
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      10-14-2017, 10:55 AM   #12
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Quote:
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^ just step on the accelerate pedal harder to build boost? once boost target is hit, wastegate opens up. if there was a way to manually open the wastegate on demand, u'll have serious turbo lag when trying to accelerate... which is pretty dumb... and no, cold start does not open up the wastegate to bypass the turbine to warm up the cats quicker. the wastesgate is normally opened until u accelerate, so either way majority of the gas is bypassing the turbine already. the louder exhaust during cold start is due to a) the exhaust flap opening and b) the higher engine idle speed.
I'm coming from e90 and I'm well aware of exhaust flap and all the golf tie mods etc. x5 is a bit different man. 35i has exhaust flap, but 50i has no such thing. Yet if you could hear 50i on cold start you won't ever say it's due to "higher engine idle speed". I'm telling you there's something else going on related to "cold start" like I said it's a warming procedure for cats mainly and i suspect wastegte is fully open during that cold start. Growl sound on cold start up (rpms are at about 1500) is like 10 times louder than if I press on accelerate pedal to same 1500 rpms when car is warmed up
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      10-15-2017, 03:52 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by retx View Post
Thank you. Just curious. You mentioned 35i has the quiet exhaust. I agree it's not loud most of time, but I can hear about 10-seconds deep and growl sound out of the exhaust when the cold engine is started. I tried to duplicate that sound, but I'm never able to.

When the engine is fired, I recalled there are often people walking toward to the back of my car to see what I have. I said to them it's 35i without mod, and it only last 10-seconds.

Long story short, I guess our quiet 35i exhaust still has the potential structure insides to make the nice sound, but I just don't know how to replicate that sound.

Any ideas? Thanks.
1) Get the Carisata app and OBD 2 car computer bluetooth adapter and open the app on your android or apple device.

2) Select the exhaust flap to "always open"

3) click code

now you will have the sound all the time
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      10-15-2017, 03:58 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DuSh View Post
I'm not 100% sure, but I think that is a so called "cold start" mode that ECU initiates on cold starts for a short duration (around 10 sec like you said). It opens up wastegates to bypass turbos and let catalytic converters warm up faster - only needed on cold start ups. basically in that scenario all gases go directly into exhaust through cats warming them up and as a consequence creating a growl that you hear. In normal mode wastegate is closed to allow gases go through the turbo and spin it up creating boost.
What I'm wondering tho, is if we can electronically open wastegates from time to time to experience that nice growl?

The exhaust has a valve on the right tailpipe. It opens when you first start "cold" engines because your car runs very rich when cold started.

The valve also opens when you hard accelerate over a certain rpm.

go over to the right tailpipe while the engine is running, you will see that nothing is coming out.

It can easily be coded to stay open, like stupid easy to code, but then you would lose some low end torque when accelerating. At lower RPM's the engine needs back pressure, at higher RPM's it needs less.

There are also noise laws which mandate that cars not be too loud when driving in town or idling. So the car's computer may not "open" the valve on the exhaust if you're sitting in your driveway revving the engine to see if it gets loud.
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      10-15-2017, 04:18 PM   #15
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Even with that passenger side flaps open, it won?t replicate the MPE sounds. Stock cold start is loud and nice sounding but it is totally different from MPE.

Here are several different scenarios of the stock and mpe exhausts cold start and MPPK warm start etc.







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      10-15-2017, 04:19 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marky Mark View Post
The exhaust has a valve on the right tailpipe. It opens when you first start "cold" engines because your car runs very rich when cold started.

The valve also opens when you hard accelerate over a certain rpm.

go over to the right tailpipe while the engine is running, you will see that nothing is coming out.

It can easily be coded to stay open, like stupid easy to code, but then you would lose some low end torque when accelerating. At lower RPM's the engine needs back pressure, at higher RPM's it needs less.

There are also noise laws which mandate that cars not be too loud when driving in town or idling. So the car's computer may not "open" the valve on the exhaust if you're sitting in your driveway revving the engine to see if it gets loud.
I think we are talking about different things lol. As I said before - 50i has no exhaust valve/flap. Yet it sounds VERY mean on cold start up. It has nothing to do with exhaust flap or valve lol

If you are trying to explain to me that 35i has exhaust valve - then yes, it does. I did a mod that keeps it open like almost 8 years ago dude on e90 platform. I can't understand people sometimes - they just act and write illogical posts lol, maybe it's just me
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      10-15-2017, 06:28 PM   #17
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and u wanting to have a way of opening the wastegates all the time, trading performance for noise, is very logical...? if the noise were from the wastegates being opened, then u would be having the same identical noise when cruising at steady throttle at speed as the wastegates would be opened when not in boost.

i think a honda with a fart can suits u better. it'll accelerate faster than ur 50i runnning with wastegates opened and be louder too
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      10-15-2017, 06:28 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DuSh View Post
I think we are talking about different things lol. As I said before - 50i has no exhaust valve/flap. Yet it sounds VERY mean on cold start up. It has nothing to do with exhaust flap or valve lol

If you are trying to explain to me that 35i has exhaust valve - then yes, it does. I did a mod that keeps it open like almost 8 years ago dude on e90 platform. I can't understand people sometimes - they just act and write illogical posts lol, maybe it's just me
Not only did you fail to see that I was replying to a different post that did not mention the 50i, but you don't know how a wastegate works either...

LoL, I guess your screen name explains everything, lol

I'l throw ya a bone though, kiddo... the way your car sounds on cold start up has something to do with the engine running rich...
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      10-16-2017, 12:32 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marky Mark View Post
Not only did you fail to see that I was replying to a different post that did not mention the 50i, but you don't know how a wastegate works either...

LoL, I guess your screen name explains everything, lol

I'l throw ya a bone though, kiddo... the way your car sounds on cold start up has something to do with the engine running rich...
First of all: I don't know what I failed, but let me show you your own post man - it's post #14 that you wrote while quoting me. Now if you are new to forum and computers in general, I can understand mistakes, but if not - then you clearly replied to me man. And now you are saying you were replying to someone else and i failed to see this? If you replied by mistake, while wanting to quote someone else - that's understandable, I take no offense, but I can't read minds right?

Secondly: my screen name is a combo of my first and last name. What are you in 5th grade to make fun of it?

Thirdly: thank you for throwing me a bone lol - I'll accept that explanation and will test it
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      10-16-2017, 12:49 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TOPEC View Post
and u wanting to have a way of opening the wastegates all the time, trading performance for noise, is very logical...?
I want to be able to open/close wastegate on demand (using Carly BMW app or similar wi-fi OBD dongle with a tablet/phone) - since wastegate is electronic - it's doable I think

Once again - yes, I'm aware i'll be trading performance for noise - that's what i asked for right? Illogical? Depends to whom and for what purpose. Are MPE logical? Not for everyone, but people spend $1300 to install it just for noise. Don't pretend you didn't knew


Quote:
Originally Posted by TOPEC View Post
if the noise were from the wastegates being opened, then u would be having the same identical noise when cruising at steady throttle at speed as the wastegates would be opened when not in boost.
Its not that easy. At cruise speeds wastegates are only partially open - I've seen maps on e90 platform and i don't think it's something drastically different in f15. The amount of exhaust flow volume that passes directly to exhaust matters a lot. That and maybe running rich is what makes that sound on cold starts as Marky Mark suggested (trowed me a bone)

Quote:
Originally Posted by TOPEC View Post
i think a honda with a fart can suits u better. it'll accelerate faster than ur 50i runnning with wastegates opened and be louder too
You wanna bet lol? Do you really think that a essentially NA (naturally aspirated) in that situation 4.4l V8 will be that bad? I don't think so. And once again - I'm looking for a deep growling sound that V8 produces - not a Honda fart can - big difference man and you know it
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      10-16-2017, 05:17 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DuSh View Post
First of all: I don't know what I failed, but let me show you your own post man - it's post #14 that you wrote while quoting me. Now if you are new to forum and computers in general, I can understand mistakes, but if not - then you clearly replied to me man. And now you are saying you were replying to someone else and i failed to see this? If you replied by mistake, while wanting to quote someone else - that's understandable, I take no offense, but I can't read minds right?

Secondly: my screen name is a combo of my first and last name. What are you in 5th grade to make fun of it?

Thirdly: thank you for throwing me a bone lol - I'll accept that explanation and will test it

I was responding to post #10, not the one that you have a screen shot of, when you click the "quote" button, it does not quote the entire post, only what you wrote... and regardless, the post that you were incorrectly referring to still does not mention 50i... so ...lol

secondly, you should google how a wastegate works, because you clearly do not get the fact that a wastegate is nothing more than a brick wall limiter on how much boost goes into the intake manifold. Open or closed, the exhaust gases still get routed back into the exhaust or atmosphere.

what I think that you are trying to refer to and are confusing with a wastegate is a blow off valve, and that still does not make the exhaust growl.

The loud exhaust sound that you are hearing on cold start up is your engines ECU making your fuel mixture rich because cold air is more dense, and thus calls for a richer fuel mix... go sit in a n/a 911. On cold start up, the exhaust sounds awesome, yet no wastegate is involved.

On a more important note, why are you taking this so much to heart? You made a mistake, no need to get your panties in a bunch and lash out at everyone... but then again, your screen name does sound like it says, "douche", hahahahaha

and what's funnier is that you actually chose that screen name! And how old are you that you use the word, "man" in almost every sentence?

perhaps you should spend your money getting a Xanax prescription instead... your temper isn't very healthy


I'll throw you another bone, though. If you want to hear your engine growl when you womp on the throttle, try replacing your airbox with a cone filter. You will probably lose a little performance as BMW makes particularly good airboxes (no matter what HP gains cone filter manufacturers claim) but the loss is negligible and you will get the sound that you are looking for.
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Last edited by Marky Mark; 10-16-2017 at 11:07 PM..
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      01-23-2021, 12:35 PM   #22
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Anyone knows the part number for the m performance muffler?
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