07-15-2016, 10:09 AM | #3 |
Mmmmm…
1148
Rep 2,426
Posts
Drives: F15
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: New York
|
Korean cars are even cheaper for the same stuff, but don't expect me to roll in a Hyundai.
|
Appreciate
0
|
07-16-2016, 04:06 AM | #8 |
Lieutenant
69
Rep 424
Posts |
Alex Dykes is the absolute best car reviewer anywhere.
It is easy to arguably be a winner on paper but it all changes once you see the car in person, drive it, touch it and get in a serious wreck. You get what you pay for. Both are great cars for what they are. |
Appreciate
0
|
07-16-2016, 04:19 AM | #9 |
Second Lieutenant
155
Rep 289
Posts |
yes you get a full Radioshack on wheels but not a drivers car just a gizmo box to enternain you whilst the chasis and engine is not there
there are german cars and than the rest ..... go figure. if something is too cheap , there is a reason somewhere in the end...... |
Appreciate
0
|
07-16-2016, 05:25 AM | #10 |
Private First Class
94
Rep 144
Posts |
I see it in a different way. German cars live on their brand and their looks, it appears that they dont feel like they have to do make an effort otherwise. The asians still try to do reliable cars and Believe in their Products, offering long guarantee programs etc. They believe in their Products.
My Kia Optima is superior to any german sedan in Everything but Engine. Much more balanced, stable, fun to drive with superior seats and interior space compared to the E-classe, 5-series etc. The new Sorento is a step back in build quality etc, I wanted a Santa Fe Sport but settled for the X5 which I still believe is the best SUV out there. But then there's build quality. As I mentioned earlier, I been to the repair shop some 15 times since I picked up my new F15 six months ago. This is more than we spent repairing our familys korean cars in the last 10 years combined. Now it's broken again and all the repair shops are fully booked for months to come. So if I get what I paid for? I paid a premium price but got a car made up of budget parts and a non-existent service to keep me rolling. But I agree, the engine was great. Until it started wearing out after a few months...whats gonna happend with this car when it starts getting old for real? Nah, asian stuff is the future. They brought us sushi, mongolian barbecue and reliable cars. A rugged Land Cruiser will do me fine in the future, gonna look like a warlord instead of a local thug. |
Appreciate
0
|
07-16-2016, 06:41 AM | #12 |
Enlisted Member
29
Rep 34
Posts |
As others have said, I think you got a lemon.
Being in the shop 15 times in 6 months is unacceptable and not indicative of what the vast majority of us experience. I'm on my 3rd x5 (2009, 2013 & 2016) and haven't been to the shop 15 times total. Have you contacted BMW about your x5 possibly being defective? |
Appreciate
0
|
07-16-2016, 06:42 AM | #13 |
Captain
540
Rep 806
Posts |
My wife owned the current gen X3 and traded it in the for a Mazda CX-5. The Mazda has more features for over 17K less and both have a 4 banger in them. The X3 offers better seating adjustments and 0-60 times but it gets interesting after that.
The CX-5 has been trouble free, uses regular gas, and normal tires. Is the X3 the better SUV? Yes. Is it 17K better? No. As BMW moves away from cars that are awesome to drive, it gets interesting as other companies catch up on the technology. I'm surprised how well the CX-5 drives. Again the X3 is a better car, but I think things are going to get interesting on the value side. |
Appreciate
0
|
07-16-2016, 07:08 AM | #14 |
Private First Class
94
Rep 144
Posts |
Its not a lemon because there is a series of quality issues common for all BMWs and not just a single one.
The windshield and fog light prompted a total of 3 visits for repairs, excluding the inspection trips. Not my car alone that suffers from this, the glass is made of the lowest possible quality and BMW chose to use it. Other brands dont. It appears to be a new thing as lot of mad owners question this on the Swedish forums aswell. The EGR valve on BMW diesels has been a issue for some 15 years. I talked to my two colleagues that also drive BMW and they both had them replaced recently. Lifetime spans from 25 000-90 000 kilometers meaning that this will reoccur. Runflats are a story on their own. I didnt have much trouble with the comfort as some, but rather them losing their balance on and off. I dont know if it is from standing still too much or hitting potholes and such too hard, it just happens and then it takes ages for them to become round again, or a re-balancing. Radiator is a total mess from chips hitting it, I started comparing this to other cars and most have better protection for it than BMW. Someone here experienced a leak in his new F15 for the same reason. And now the thermostat broke too. I don't think its a lemon, I think BMW realised that there is Money to be made on building with cheap parts and then overcharging repairs. The same argument could be applied to the fact that BMW is the most theft-strucken brand over here in Europe, where cars are stripped of their parts in huge amounts. While Mercedes adressed this and made the navigation etc hard to come off, BMW has Everything come off fast and easly. There are plenty of reports here of whole neighbourhoods with every BMW being broken into on a single night, while all other premium cars were left intact. They then charge the Insurance companies 15 000-20 000$ here to restore them with navigation, airbags etc. So, as a summary, other BMW owners do pay alot of visits to the repair shop aswell. But BMW is being forgiven for it all, because people say theft, budget glass, budget engines, crappy tires etc is someone elses foult. But it can all be adressed, if BMW just wanted to. |
Appreciate
0
|
07-16-2016, 07:20 AM | #15 | |
Captain
248
Rep 748
Posts |
Quote:
I love how you tell the rest of the flock what we have. Regardless to the fact that vast majority of your issues are somewhat rare.
__________________
Ones drove a Reliant Robin. )))
|
|
Appreciate
0
|
07-16-2016, 07:41 AM | #16 | |
Private First Class
94
Rep 144
Posts |
Yea I know, you make more friends promoting animal abuse than claiming a Kia is better than any german car. But I can honesly say - sedans, Kia won and I got myself a Kia. All my colleagues drove mostly E-classe but a few Audi/BMW too, I never once felt any of them were better cars.
SUVs - BMW was better. Quote:
And lastly, you live in an area that never gets snow so you never had issues with stone chips. Neither did we until BMW figured out that money could easly be made on this while blaming someone else. |
|
Appreciate
0
|
07-16-2016, 11:39 AM | #17 | |
Lieutenant
139
Rep 452
Posts |
Quote:
|
|
Appreciate
0
|
07-16-2016, 12:30 PM | #18 | |
First Lieutenant
132
Rep 362
Posts
Drives: 2016 X3 xDrive 35i
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Maryland
|
Quote:
In US News and World Report rankings the Kia Optima (overall score 8.4) was ranked #9 in its class below the Chevrolet Malibu, Honda Accord, Mazda 6 and many others. There were no German cars in the group with the Optima (unless you want to include the VW Passat built in the US for the US market at #13) but cars like Audi (Overall 9.0) and BMW (Overall 8.6) were rated substantially better than the Optima in their own groups. I will concede that the Optima offers excellent value. As another publication stated, "Of course, the Optima still doesn’t have what it takes to compete with the likes of the BMW 5 Series, but it’s more than suited to give the Ford Fusion and the Mazda6 a run for their money." http://www.topspeed.com/cars/kia/201...-ar165165.html Last edited by MichiganMike; 07-16-2016 at 12:39 PM.. |
|
Appreciate
0
|
07-16-2016, 02:22 PM | #19 |
Private First Class
94
Rep 144
Posts |
Thats the new 2016 Optima, I havent driven it so I have no opinion on it either, except for that the design is a step back instead of a step forward. I dont expect any ranking to place the Optima higher than a german premium sedan, as they would get the same feedback that I did here. As for the BMW 5-series, it came up short both the year I bought my Optima and my 2011 Saab 9-5 NG.
My breakdown of the Optima -Handling. Almost no body roll and perfect balance. Top Gear actually made an insert about its balance. Steering quite perfect aswell. The Mercedes E or C both feel "spongier" and less balanced, I found the E classe to be extremely instable in Sharp curves. The BMW feels quite stable but numb. Road feel is most present in the Optima. High speed stability (Autobahn), Kia wins again. -Engine. Could have wished for more than 137 hp diesel and the Optima is here inferior to the german cars. It did however come with bigger gasoline Engines in other markets. Considering my Engine failures with the high output 2 litre BMW diesel, I wonder if the higher german output is at the cost of reliability. -Transmission. Superior in the Optima to anything else I had. It responds quickly and I cant feel the gear changes. I do feel them in my BMW, which also has that one second lag every time I press the gas pedal. This might however have to do with the diesel turbo. Tried to find out who makes this gearbox but havent been able to do so. The newer E classes had a double-clutch transmission fitted in and my colleagues were unhappy with it, as it's rather non-responsive and has more, as in too many, noticable gear shifts than their previous Mercedeses. -Noise level. Higher in the Optima than competition but reduces greatly once the stock Korean tires are switched to something better. This was adressed in the 2014 facelift. -Interior space. Far better in the Optima than german competition. Front row feels roomy and you sit much higher than in the german cars. For whatever reason, they all feel like you're sitting on the ground below. The E-classe and A6 has a doable back row, while the 5-series is completely unseatable back there. The Optima seats even grown males comfortably in the back seats, even behind tall front row passengers. I compared the cars next to eachother and found that the germans like making long hoods and small, low cabins, which makes the car look bigger than it is. -Seats. Superior in the Kia Optima. My brand-loving colleagues Always mocked me for the Kia but they too Always commented on comfortable the seats were. The E-classe, like any Mercedes, had no match for this, the 5-series can match this with the expensive multi-contour seats and I dont know about the options on the A6, but I couldnt get comfortable in the one we had. -Reliability. Mercedes E-classe and Optima probably wins. My collagues who traded in for newer Mercedeses however also react to how sensetive the windshields have become. So, I hope this provides some more detalied information than "Kia cant be better than Germany, end of story". We do have a brand new 2017 E-classe on our workplace too, and I find that one being a huge step back compared to the previous one. It not only looks excatly like the C-classe now, but the car is also now lower and I find the cabin much less spaceous than Before. If you look at the wide panel in the middle, the big handle sticking out from the door and the huge screens in the front, there's not much room left for the driver and you can barely see out of the car. Seats are still uncomfortable even when upgraded. I would take the older one over the 2017 E-classe, but I would be UnhappierSwede if God made the E-classe my everyday car. |
Appreciate
0
|
07-16-2016, 03:08 PM | #20 | |
Captain
248
Rep 748
Posts |
Quote:
Most recent winter. Jetta is the one i bought for my college son, and Toyota is the one i keep for my guests.
__________________
Ones drove a Reliant Robin. )))
|
|
Appreciate
1
madzu4.00 |
07-16-2016, 06:41 PM | #21 |
Private First Class
55
Rep 171
Posts |
I researched many of the upper end Asian brands before buying the X5. They were under powered and gutless, cramped and uncomfortable, and frequently down right ugly. I don't care how reliable they are or how crammed full of gadgets if they fail at that. Just my 2 cents worth.
|
Appreciate
0
|
07-16-2016, 07:25 PM | #22 |
Enlisted Member
17
Rep 39
Posts
Drives: 2016 X5 eDrive40e
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Mill Creek, Washington
|
Japanese cars are a dime a dozen. Many people that buy them could care less about performance.
|
Appreciate
0
|
Post Reply |
Bookmarks |
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
|
|