BMW X5 and X6 Forum 2014-Current
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      02-18-2017, 11:43 PM   #1
mr_coo168
New Member
4
Rep
27
Posts

Drives: X5
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: boston

iTrader: (0)

steering wheel

anyway to make it tighter?
Appreciate 0
      02-19-2017, 06:44 AM   #2
Kzang
Major General
Kzang's Avatar
3221
Rep
5,058
Posts

Drives: 2015 X5 35i Msport SG
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: East Coast

iTrader: (0)

Not really, but you may get use to the light steering and prefer it, like I did. After having 2 E60's and one E70 with what I feel like now was extraordinary heavy steering, I feel like the F15 steering is perfect and precise.
__________________
2015 F15 X5 35i Msport Space Grey M Performance parts MPPK, MPE
Appreciate 1
Chadmatic660.50
      02-19-2017, 12:14 PM   #3
pragueX5
Second Lieutenant
pragueX5's Avatar
Czech_Republic
155
Rep
289
Posts

Drives: 2021 X5 M 40d mildhybrid
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: PRAGUE, Czech Rep.

iTrader: (0)

F15 definitely does not have precise steering.
wish there was a software way to make it tigheter. even the sport mode is soft and wobbly, lacking feedback.... E70 was precise like a swiss watch
Appreciate 0
      02-19-2017, 01:15 PM   #4
IvanLZ
Lieutenant
IvanLZ's Avatar
Canada
139
Rep
452
Posts

Drives: 2015 X5 35i
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Toronto

iTrader: (0)

No
Appreciate 0
      02-19-2017, 02:34 PM   #5
P1
Lieutenant General
P1's Avatar
11542
Rep
11,128
Posts

Drives: 2004 3/4 ton Duramax
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: United States

iTrader: (1)

You'll get used to it. I've had mine since July and I've made peace with it.
Appreciate 0
      02-20-2017, 02:33 AM   #6
wakethetown
Enlisted Member
wakethetown's Avatar
24
Rep
44
Posts

Drives: 2015 X5 xDrive 50i
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Seattle, WA

iTrader: (0)

I purchased a 2015 50i at the beginning of the year with 9500 miles on it. Loving the car. But I have to agree that I haven't gotten used to the feel of the light steering wheel. My wife has a 2015 X1, which I believe was one of the last models to have hydraulic steering. I love the way the car handles, you can really feel the road, and was hoping for something similar with the X5. It reminds a bit too much of the "power steering" of cars like my grandfather's 1973 Plymouth Duster.
Appreciate 0
      02-20-2017, 08:20 AM   #7
Kzang
Major General
Kzang's Avatar
3221
Rep
5,058
Posts

Drives: 2015 X5 35i Msport SG
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: East Coast

iTrader: (0)

Can we be a little more specific with details when we describe steering wheel feel? Road feel is very different with 20" and summer rubber than 19" and taller skinnier tires. My 20's with Dunlop summer performance run flat tires feel precise and accurate. I hated the heavy unnecessary steering at low parking lot speeds on the E70's and I will admit that highway speeds were good, but the F15 with the above specs at highway speeds are pretty good as well.
__________________
2015 F15 X5 35i Msport Space Grey M Performance parts MPPK, MPE
Appreciate 0
      02-20-2017, 10:55 AM   #8
stewy604
Lieutenant Colonel
stewy604's Avatar
289
Rep
1,547
Posts

Drives: 2014 BMW X5 xDrive 35d M Sport
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Vancouver, B.C.

iTrader: (0)

I actually don't mind the steering feel on the F15, not sure I would want it any tighter. My E82 has a heavy wheel, which I like in that type of car.
__________________
2014 BMW X5 xDrive 35d M Sport Mineral White
2011 BMW 135i M Sport Space Grey
2007 Suzuki GSX-R 750
Appreciate 0
      02-20-2017, 05:02 PM   #9
OEMJumper
Private First Class
379
Rep
192
Posts

Drives: Space Grey F15 M Sport
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Queens

iTrader: (0)

I agree the steering feels a little too light and would prefer to have it feel tighter and heavier. I will admit it got a little better after I lowered the car..but not by that much
__________________
Donington grey F97 X3M Competition | Sakhir Orange | H&R Springs | M performance Steering wheel | OEM Carbon paddle shifters | Spacers
Appreciate 0
      02-20-2017, 07:04 PM   #10
wakethetown
Enlisted Member
wakethetown's Avatar
24
Rep
44
Posts

Drives: 2015 X5 xDrive 50i
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Seattle, WA

iTrader: (0)

When I bought the car it had the original RF Bridgestone Duellers (20" staggered set-up). I swapped these out for Winter: Non-Run Flat Blizzak DM-V2 (20" squared set-up).

The Blizzak's feel very different--the ride is less harsh and the tracking is better.

However, the steering is equally light. By light, I mean the wheel turns very easily, the feeling is that you are gliding rather that getting a positive, responsive feedback back from the road. I didn't receive my PhD in automotive phenomenology, but that's how I experience it. It feels quite different from others cars I have driven, especially my wife's X1.

In an article from Car & Driver they put it like this: "EPS-equipped cars, we’ve found them lacking in feel, poorly tuned, and sometimes simply weird in comparison with the hydraulic-assist setups that have benefited from more than half a century of development. This matters because steering is the driver’s main line of communication with the car; distortion in the guidance channel makes every other perception more difficult to comprehend."

And, "Measuring what’s going on with the tires and the suspension indirectly amounts to intelligent guesswork, but it’s the best we have today to minimize EPS’s limitations. No wonder we found hydraulic better than electric assist in our subjective Feedback analysis."

http://www.caranddriver.com/features...n-test-feature
Appreciate 0
      02-21-2017, 01:55 AM   #11
wakethetown
Enlisted Member
wakethetown's Avatar
24
Rep
44
Posts

Drives: 2015 X5 xDrive 50i
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Seattle, WA

iTrader: (0)

Another article thst helps to explain the experience:
http://www.motorauthority.com/news/1081363_electric-power-steering-we-ask-an-insider-where-its-headed

"
In the initial days, it was a very rudimentary system. Somebody nailed together the parts and came up with some control strategies that seemed to work—left was left, right was right—and you could adjust the assist level. But nobody really put a lot of thought into the idea of what are you missing from a hydraulic system, that you need in order to make it feel more natural. And to be honest, I think some vehicles today are lacking some of that in their systems. It all comes down to being able to generate or transmit a feel in the steering wheel that fits your mental perception of what the vehicle is doing.

So specifically, a lot of times what you'll see is that you have systems that lack damping. You turn into the corner and it feels okay turning in, but coming out, it just wants to fall back to center, and your natural motion is that you turn in, you have a certain effort progression, it needs to be a linear progression of effort and response. Today what happens with those ‘bad’ systems is that you go up on a good torque curve, and coming back you either have too much or too little damping. Some of the worst systems require a good amount of force going into the corner, then the torque just falls away and the steering gear just wants to slam back to center. Subjectively, you want to feel like you go right up an effort curve and then back down the same curve—it needs to feel the same loading and unloading. Anything else is unnatural."
Appreciate 0
      02-21-2017, 03:04 PM   #12
pragueX5
Second Lieutenant
pragueX5's Avatar
Czech_Republic
155
Rep
289
Posts

Drives: 2021 X5 M 40d mildhybrid
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: PRAGUE, Czech Rep.

iTrader: (0)

well written simply zero feedback from the wheels back to the driver - if you are in to driving and drive more and different than to your local supermarket..... the Bmw pedigree and enginenpower is simply not it balance with the "soccer mom" type of steering setup/ response
Appreciate 0
      02-21-2017, 06:07 PM   #13
flexfusion
Private
20
Rep
68
Posts

Drives: 2016 F15
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Alabama

iTrader: (0)

Driving my wife's MB E350 brings back the days of driving my E70.....road feel and precision. I can't imagine how BMW engineers get the F15 steering so wrong. I really like my F15 but just don't like the way it steers.
Appreciate 0
      02-22-2017, 07:10 AM   #14
superdog
Private First Class
76
Rep
156
Posts

Drives: BMW X5 50i M Sport
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Jersey

iTrader: (0)

I was very concerned about the light steering.

After a day of spirited driving, I've no concerns left. I actually like it very much.

Would I tighten it if I could? Yes, just a bit. But I'm good the way it is.
Appreciate 0
      02-22-2017, 08:48 AM   #15
double_j
First Lieutenant
85
Rep
331
Posts

Drives: 2008 JB/B E90 M3
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Northeast USA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kzang View Post
Can we be a little more specific with details when we describe steering wheel feel? Road feel is very different with 20" and summer rubber than 19" and taller skinnier tires. My 20's with Dunlop summer performance run flat tires feel precise and accurate. I hated the heavy unnecessary steering at low parking lot speeds on the E70's and I will admit that highway speeds were good, but the F15 with the above specs at highway speeds are pretty good as well.
When we say light steering, we generally mean that there is very little feeling of connection between the steering wheel and the tires on the road. Steering effort is generally low (the effort gives no indication about the degree to which tires are turned) and it's very difficult to feel what the front tires are experiencing (grip level, bumps, etc.)

The X5's steering isn't inaccurate per se, but the stock steering definitely can give one a sense that there's a bit of play between the wheel and the front tires. It's simply not confidence inspiring in stock form. High speed sweeping turns require constant adjustments to hold a line because there's not enough steering effort to help the driver keep the wheels at a constant angle.

If you feel an example of good steering, drive an older sports car if you get a chance. I had an E46 M3 and a 911 and the steering in those cars was absolutely alive. Appropriate weighting and effort made it feel like you were holding onto the front wheels directly and every bump, change in road surface, or change in traction levels was transmitted back through the wheel into your hands. Good steering lets you know exactly what's going on at the point of contact with the road.

Of course, the benefits of a more analogue feeling steering setup usually come at the expense of comfort and this is why lighter steering that requires less steering effort and and provides less feedback is preferable for the luxo-barge/cruiser set. Much more comfortable to drive, especially at low speeds or over longer distances.

Unfortunately, this is the crowd that BMW is now chasing to steal share from Mercedes. On the plus side, it seems to be working for them in terms of total sales. On the down side, the moniker "Ultimate Driving Machine" may not be totally relevant anymore.
Appreciate 0
      02-22-2017, 09:13 AM   #16
Kzang
Major General
Kzang's Avatar
3221
Rep
5,058
Posts

Drives: 2015 X5 35i Msport SG
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: East Coast

iTrader: (0)

I've driven cars with no assisted steering for along time before and other older cars to understand what you are saying. However I just have to disagree... when I want to drive aggressively, I want to be able to turn the steering wheel with less effort and quicker than the traditional hydraulic wheels. With my current steering, I can feel as much road feel as I did with my E70 and E60 cars... Maybe the tire type has to do with it... only difference is that my wife can now drive in parking lot speeds and park the car without looking like a wrestler.
__________________
2015 F15 X5 35i Msport Space Grey M Performance parts MPPK, MPE
Appreciate 0
      02-22-2017, 12:59 PM   #17
double_j
First Lieutenant
85
Rep
331
Posts

Drives: 2008 JB/B E90 M3
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Northeast USA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kzang View Post
I've driven cars with no assisted steering for along time before and other older cars to understand what you are saying. However I just have to disagree... when I want to drive aggressively, I want to be able to turn the steering wheel with less effort and quicker than the traditional hydraulic wheels. With my current steering, I can feel as much road feel as I did with my E70 and E60 cars... Maybe the tire type has to do with it... only difference is that my wife can now drive in parking lot speeds and park the car without looking like a wrestler.
To each his own but keep in mind that it's less about absolute steering effort (especially since it naturally gets easier to steer at higher speeds) and more about feeling like there's a direct connection between the steering wheels and the tires. A little bit of weight on the steering wheel while on a constant line or feedback from the road surface goes a long way towards fostering that feeling.

Upgraded/modified tires/wheels/suspension should absolutely have an impact on steering feel but I don't think anybody would refute that the steering setup on the X5 in stock form is a bit lackluster. Anybody who says it's actually good (in stock form) likely hasn't yet driven a car with really good steering to compare.
Appreciate 1
Kzang3220.50
      02-22-2017, 01:13 PM   #18
Flying Ace
Lieutenant General
Flying Ace's Avatar
4983
Rep
11,891
Posts

Drives: G05 45e, 997.1 & 991.1 GT3s
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: SF, CA

iTrader: (5)

yes, trade your car in for a E70
__________________
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:17 AM.




xbimmers
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST