Is the diesel engine that great?

[turboawd]

i debated on getting a diesel, but never did bother to test drive one, since i fell in love test driving a gas model, and signed a deal. but after reading how some of you rave about the diesel, is it really that great?
so it gets better mileage, yes. but financially it doesnt pay off unless you drive it a long time.
so tell me about how she drives. and if you guys rub it in any more, i might have to go test one and get out of my current lease.

[wjbender]

From an economics point of view, you would need to drive it an long time to break even. The power and torque characteristics of the diesel are very well suited to a heavy vehicle. It feels effortless off the line, almost like the V8. The acceleration is without drama as the engine is quiet and goes about its thing without high revs. I get about 500 - 600 miles between refueling, which is nice on a trip. Mixed driving gts me about 26 mpg. It is also a great towing machine. The resale value will be higher when the time comes to sell - I am very pleased and do not see any downside

[touchdown83]

Originally Posted by wjbender

From an economics point of view, you would need to drive it an long time to break even. The power and torque characteristics of the diesel are very well suited to a heavy vehicle. It feels effortless off the line, almost like the V8. The acceleration is without drama as the engine is quiet and goes about its thing without high revs. I get about 500 - 600 miles between refueling, which is nice on a trip. Mixed driving gts me about 26 mpg. It is also a great towing machine. The resale value will be higher when the time comes to sell - I am very pleased and do not see any downside

How are you getting that kind of mileage? I can't seem to get over 23, I have for over a month and haven't gotten to 500/tank yet, and most of my mileage is highway. Do you have a racechip in it?

[turboawd]

my 35i does ok on the highway. maybe 24-25 mpg. in city it gets like 16-18 mpg.

[wjbender]

Originally Posted by touchdown83

How are you getting that kind of mileage? I can't seem to get over 23, I have for over a month and haven't gotten to 500/tank yet, and most of my mileage is highway. Do you have a racechip in it?

It is rated for 27 mixed - I got over 36 on a long trip, and others have done better. I do not have a chip. here is more info on diesel fuel and mileage
http://f15.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1007227

http://f15.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1007227

[schaeffs]

Originally Posted by wjbender

From an economics point of view, you would need to drive it an long time to break even. The power and torque characteristics of the diesel are very well suited to a heavy vehicle. It feels effortless off the line, almost like the V8. The acceleration is without drama as the engine is quiet and goes about its thing without high revs. I get about 500 - 600 miles between refueling, which is nice on a trip. Mixed driving gts me about 26 mpg. It is also a great towing machine. The resale value will be higher when the time comes to sell - I am very pleased and do not see any downside

Agree - if you have a petrol car then keep it, as they are good engines too.

But think about your next car being diesel as the engines match the type of car very well. The latest diesel we have is extraordinary - it really is - the M50d. The 40d we had previously was also an excellent engine.

The M50d pulls like a locomotive down low so progress is easy in such a big heavy car, but will rev out happily with real vigour as well. It even sounds good - although there is definitely some sound trickery going on to achieve that (personally I couldn't care less that there are some fake noises going on but some people do).

Drive one when your lease is coming due - you might just get seduced by the dark side!

[E90Fleet]

Even the latest Diesel engines are too agricultural for me.
The M50d is great, but give me the X50i V8 over it anytime.

Gasoline engines are much more refined and give off less emissions these days. The new generations have also come a long way in closing the mileage gap.

[lowlevelhell]

Originally Posted by E90Fleet

Even the latest Diesel engines are too agricultural for me.
The M50d is great, but give me the X50i V8 over it anytime.

Gasoline engines are much more refined and give off less emissions these days. The new generations have also come a long way in closing the mileage gap.

The new ones have come a long way on paper. The big difference between a gas engine and a diesel engine, speaking purely in terms of mileage, is that you get the performance of the diesel engine while actually seeing the good mileage it's capable of. The projected fuel economy for gas engines is rather unattainable unless you drive it with a very smooth and feathery foot and don't try to get it to produce its best power. That is a function of the mechanics of the two types of motors and of the way in which fuel mileage numbers are produced.

Drive that 50i like you want to drive a 50i and you might as well forget about the estimated fuel economy number.

[MattBianco]

X5 Engines Compared. Emission is lower, acceleration to 50mph is faster, MPG is better:
http://f15.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1121787

Real life MPGs:
http://f15.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1081659

For me, it was a choice between the 35d and 50i after driving all three.

[E90Fleet]

Originally Posted by MattBianco

X5 Engines Compared. Emission is lower,

Only CO2
Diesels produce a lot of nitrates that arnt shown n teh charts. they also produce a large amount of particulates, even with particulate filters fitted.
All round Diesels give off more harmful emissions than modern gasoline engines.

Thats why many cities like Paris and London are looking at banning Diesel vehicles.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/eart...ners-warn.html

[E90Fleet]

Originally Posted by lowlevelhell

Drive that 50i like you want to drive a 50i and you might as well forget about the estimated fuel economy number.

Yup, I buy cars to to have fun in, not to save gas. So the gas engines win for me. The Diesels just spoil fun, especially the smaller ones.

Others may have other priorities.

[wjbender]

Originally Posted by MattBianco

X5 Engines Compared. Emission is lower, acceleration to 50mph is faster, MPG is better:
http://f15.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1121787

Real life MPGs:
http://f15.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1081659

For me, it was a choice between the 35d and 50i after driving all three.

+1 - I LOVE the power of the V8, but being the frugal person I am, the frequent fueling stops and poor MPG would be annoying. For most daily driving the low end grunt of the oil burner is perfect.

[lowlevelhell]

Originally Posted by wjbender

+1 - I LOVE the power of the V8, but being the frugal person I am, the frequent fueling stops and poor MPG would be annoying. For most daily driving the low end grunt of the oil burner is perfect.

Remember too that you get to combine that grunt with 8 gears instead of 5 or 6. Throw a chip on the N57 diesel and you've got the same power and +100 torque as the previous 4.8i

BMW V8s are sure fun, but reliability isn't a strong suit.

[wjbender]

Originally Posted by lowlevelhell

Remember too that you get to combine that grunt with 8 gears instead of 5 or 6. Throw a chip on the N57 diesel and you've got the same power and +100 torque as the previous 4.8i

BMW V8s are sure fun, but reliability isn't a strong suit.

LOL not like the ol small block chevy

[lowlevelhell]

Not a graceful engine, but like a 302 Ford it's practically bulletproof. I think it would be a hoot to build an old X5 out with a ZZ4 crate motor. 450 hp on premium pump gas with no power adders.

[Mentat]

So I'll tell my history, in Europe.

1. BWM 30d (218 HP) - sold
2. BMW 30 SD (286 HP) -still in the family, now 330 HP. Great car.
3. BMW X6M (555 HP) Hamann - sold yesterday
4. Land Rover 5.0 SC - 510 HP (on sale)
5. Jaguar XKR 5.0 SC Red - 510 HP = my love.


6. So, after 3 years of big gasoline engines, I had enough!
Yes, they sound great, but that's it!

The fuel economy is terrible and in my country 1l of gas is ~ 1.2 EUR ~ 1.3 USD ~ 5 USD/Gallon!

On X6M, I rarely saw 20l/100 Km ~ 11.76 MPG US!
On Land Rover, the medium fuel "economy" was 21l/100km ~ 11.2 mpg US!

After ~ 4 years, I'm back to diesel! I'm waiting for my X5 M50d (381 HP).
I've already ordered a tuning box ~ 420 HP!

7. Land Rover Evoque 2.2 SD (190 HP) for my wife (planned soon)

[wjbender]

Originally Posted by lowlevelhell

Not a graceful engine, but like a 302 Ford it's practically bulletproof. I think it would be a hoot to build an old X5 out with a ZZ4 crate motor. 450 hp on premium pump gas with no power adders.

No elegance there, just brute HP

[MattBianco]

Originally Posted by E90Fleet

Only CO2
Diesels produce a lot of nitrates that arnt shown n teh charts. they also produce a large amount of particulates, even with particulate filters fitted.
All round Diesels give off more harmful emissions than modern gasoline engines.

Thats why many cities like Paris and London are looking at banning Diesel vehicles.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/eart...ners-warn.html

I think the jury is still out. Test show that well to wheel total emissions (emission in refining included) are actually lower for modern diesels. Euro diesels pre 2009, many without DPF, are the biggest culprits in Europe. Below is a comparison of the Jetta in gas, vs US TDI and Euro TDI. The US version has better emissions, in fact better than Europe TDI and better than gas. I believe Euro zone is implementing the higher standard 2016, but I cannot find where I read that. At any rate, in the US, diesel is cleaner.




source, which references the model and assumptions: http://webpages.charter.net/lmarz/emissions1.html

Source concludes: "As can be seen, "clean diesel" vehicles are generally no "worse" with respect to total well-to-wheels emissions than the cleanest gasoline vehicles due to the nature of the very low volatility of diesel fuel and overall lower emissions in the WTP phase, even though the Jetta TDI is "only" certified T2B5/ULEV II, while the 2.5 gasoline version is certified T2B2/PZEV. In fact, total well-to-wheels emissions are lower across-the-board in the case of the VW Jetta."

[akhter]

I just got my first diesel car. It sounds a bit rough when the windows are rolled down. There is no turbine smoothness of the I6 gas engine. In all other respect its seems equal or better. I didn't think too much because I bought the car off the lot and they only had a diesel with the options i wanted. Absolutely no regrets. Love the instant torque...

[watrob]

The problem is the US will mostly never get the M50d, well not until you refine your diesel more.

You cannot compare at 30d, 35d or the 40d to a M50d, basically with a M50d your getting the X5M but with a triple turbo diesel engine with 750nm+ torque instead but with double the fuel economy and half the service costs and half the insurance premium.

The M50d goes straight to 260kmh and pulls like freight train, comparing the 50i V8 to the 35d is not a comparison and the 50i will always feel the better engine.

I would rather sit the traffic in my M50d than the X5M any day and is those circumstance a 35d would probably be even better?

[wjbender]

Originally Posted by watrob

The problem is the US will mostly never get the M50d, well not until you refine your diesel more.

You cannot compare at 30d, 35d or the 40d to a M50d, basically with a M50d your getting the X5M but with a triple turbo diesel engine with 750nm+ torque instead but with double the fuel economy and half the service costs and half the insurance premium.

The M50d goes straight to 260kmh and pulls like freight train, comparing the 50i V8 to the 35d is not a comparison and the 50i will always feel the better engine.

I would rather sit the traffic in my M50d than the X5M any day and is those circumstance a 35d would probably be even better?

sadly the best we can do is chip the 35d which brings the performance up to 40d level. How I wish we had the 50d here in the USA

[suprolla]

One of the big assumptions with payback on the diesel is that its more expensive than regular gasoline. Hmmm, when was the last time you filled your 35i with regular?

Around me, diesel has almost always been less than premium, sometimes on par with regular.