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      11-27-2013, 08:12 AM   #45
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Residual on the 50i is great--67% for 24 mos
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      11-27-2013, 10:38 AM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaw View Post
why don't you guys finance the car but with a balloon amount? It is far better than lease...and you would own the car plus the fact that you have no limitations on the mileage and tires and all other stuff...(not to mention the extra costs associated to that!)
the monthly payments are similar to a lease (even lower)
residual value? well a car that was financed has a higher residual value than a leased one...so even if you decide not pay the balloon and trade it in with another car, you can with a higher value (normally a couple of thousands of dollars higher)...also you get the tax savings when you trade on your new ride...
you can also sell the car privately at a higher price...
I don't see any value by leasing...you are essentially throwing your money out without owning a handle of the car at the end...
make sense?
No, not really. Leasing involves only paying for the depreciation (plus tax) for the duration of the lease period. With MSD's, the MF can less than 2% - and you get the deposit back at the end. They you have the option to buy the lease out, or return it in if it had problems, new model, etc.

Makes perfect sense to me ....
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      11-27-2013, 11:15 AM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chiefmike View Post
15K upfront, 68K list, 10K miles, $394 which includes Taxes & Plates.
Not sure I understand. You didn't put 15k down on a lease did you?
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      11-27-2013, 11:24 AM   #48
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It looks like he did That is the only way he could get a less than $400 monthly payment on a $68k vehicle. Insane!!!!!!



Quote:
Originally Posted by darksilkx1 View Post
Not sure I understand. You didn't put 15k down on a lease did you?
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      11-27-2013, 11:27 AM   #49
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Is leasing still not more expensive vs. buying in the long run? Lets say you like to keep the car for longer, I think buying will be cheaper? Sure it's nice to drive a brand new car every 3-4 years I always thought of leasing like renting almost lol
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      11-27-2013, 11:38 AM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patrob View Post
Is leasing still not more expensive vs. buying in the long run? Lets say you like to keep the car for longer, I think buying will be cheaper? Sure it's nice to drive a brand new car every 3-4 years I always thought of leasing like renting almost lol
Leasing is exactly like renting....BMW leases are by far the cheapest of all the luxury brands - which is why so many of us lease. The total cost either way is mainly a function of what price you pay for the vehicle. The finance rate vs. money factor are essentially the same (2.99% vs 3.00%). With MSD's on a lease, you can reduce the MF to just over 1.5% - plus you get the deposit back at lease end.

Buying the lease out at the end is probably more expensive that just straight financing, however, the benefit of a lease is that you get to "test" the vehicle for 36 months for essentially straight depreciation - then you have the option to buy it if you so choose. You can then apply your MSD's towards buying it out.
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      11-27-2013, 11:46 AM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NikonMan View Post
Leasing is exactly like renting....BMW leases are by far the cheapest of all the luxury brands - which is why so many of us lease. The total cost either way is mainly a function of what price you pay for the vehicle. The finance rate vs. money factor are essentially the same (2.99% vs 3.00%). With MSD's on a lease, you can reduce the MF to just over 1.5% - plus you get the deposit back at lease end.

Buying the lease out at the end is probably more expensive that just straight financing, however, the benefit of a lease is that you get to "test" the vehicle for 36 months for essentially straight depreciation - then you have the option to buy it if you so choose. You can then apply your MSD's towards buying it out.
Thanks, this helps! I wish I knew all this leasing stuff when we bought our X5 back in the day This time around I will be very educated thanks to this forum
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      11-27-2013, 11:53 AM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NikonMan View Post
Finance rate is 2.99%
Lease rate is 3.00%

Difference is .01%

With 7 MSD's on a lease you can reduce the rate to 1.17%
Regarding the use of multiple security deposits, it's overstating the case to say they bring the MF down that much because this neglects the fact that you will earn nothing on that money over the lease period. Indeed, with the current BMW MF being equal to a 3% loan rate, you will likely lose money by putting in multiple security deposits: surely you should be able to earn at least 3% per year on your money by investing it something.
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      11-27-2013, 12:16 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tiburonh View Post
Regarding the use of multiple security deposits, it's overstating the case to say they bring the MF down that much because this neglects the fact that you will earn nothing on that money over the lease period. Indeed, with the current BMW MF being equal to a 3% loan rate, you will likely lose money by putting in multiple security deposits: surely you should be able to earn at least 3% per year on your money by investing it something.
While this is theoretically true, the return on the MSD deposit at say ~2.5% (good luck getting anything higher than that for 36 months) is in reality more like 2% as you would have to subtract the additional $40 or dollars a month you save with the reduced MF (~$1400 savings).

Essentially, while you do not earn anything by parking your MSD with BMWFS, you save (in this example) ~$1400 over the 36 months.

No brainer as far as I am concerned ....

Last edited by NikonMan; 11-28-2013 at 09:49 AM..
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      11-27-2013, 01:45 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NikonMan
Lease payments are fairly straight forward to compute ... MF is 3% (.00125) and the residual is 61% for 10k miles for the current program.

The residual value is the predicted value of the vehicle at the end of the lease term. The difference between your negotiated cost and the residual value is what you pay for - amortized over the term of the lease.

The monthly payment is a function of the cap cost (less cash down) + finance charge + tax. Items paid outside of the lease (acquisition, docs, etc.) are excluded from the lease payment. Tax is paid on the monthly depreciation amount, plus the finance charge.

As such comparative lease payments are not of much value as it entirely depends on the negotiated capital cost of the vehicle, less cash down reduction, plus whatever the local tax rate is.
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      11-27-2013, 03:11 PM   #55
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i need to own my car....can't think of leasing...
after 2 years owning a X3...I needed money...so i sold it for only $14,000 lower than what I had purchased back in 2011... I sold my X3 to my own client but via dealership convenience trade, and saved another $6,000 on the taxes of the new ordered X5...
I have a friend.. has leased a Mercedes...in need of money/hence can't pay the bills, is looking for someone to take over lease (11 months remaining)...holly s...t it's difficult!!! it's been 3 months on the market...not a sole interested...
i sold my X3 in a week...cashed in...settled my debt...ordered a X5...saved additionally on taxes...I don't see any advantage had I leased the X3....
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      11-27-2013, 10:37 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaw View Post
i need to own my car....can't think of leasing...
after 2 years owning a X3...I needed money...so i sold it for only $14,000 lower than what I had purchased back in 2011... I sold my X3 to my own client but via dealership convenience trade, and saved another $6,000 on the taxes of the new ordered X5...
I have a friend.. has leased a Mercedes...in need of money/hence can't pay the bills, is looking for someone to take over lease (11 months remaining)...holly s...t it's difficult!!! it's been 3 months on the market...not a sole interested...
i sold my X3 in a week...cashed in...settled my debt...ordered a X5...saved additionally on taxes...I don't see any advantage had I leased the X3....
Hard to say why your friend couldn't get out of his lease but this is a bad example to support your view. The lease could of been in an unfavorable term/amount, not willing to pay lease transfer fee, bad condition not popular color and options or bunch of other possible reasons. Did he try to get carmax or someone to buy it out instead ? Probably didn't because again not favorable or he was upside down.
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      11-28-2013, 07:35 AM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oatmeal View Post
Hard to say why your friend couldn't get out of his lease but this is a bad example to support your view. The lease could of been in an unfavorable term/amount, not willing to pay lease transfer fee, bad condition not popular color and options or bunch of other possible reasons. Did he try to get carmax or someone to buy it out instead ? Probably didn't because again not favorable or he was upside down.
I understand. There are always bad deals in all scenarios...I guess it is also a personal taste...also in scenarios where you would want to keep the car past the term, I think financing is a better deal.
So let me get something straight: in a lease scenario, let's say I put $10,000 down upfront. Would that 10k be balanced against the residual value at the end of the term? So let's say, if the car is worth $20,000 at the end of the lease term, I only pay $10,000 more?
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      11-28-2013, 09:44 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaw View Post
I understand. There are always bad deals in all scenarios...I guess it is also a personal taste...also in scenarios where you would want to keep the car past the term, I think financing is a better deal.
So let me get something straight: in a lease scenario, let's say I put $10,000 down upfront. Would that 10k be balanced against the residual value at the end of the term? So let's say, if the car is worth $20,000 at the end of the lease term, I only pay $10,000 more?
It reduced the capitalized cost (whatp you agreed to ay for the car) of the vehicle and hence reduces your monthly payment. Residual is fix as a percentage of the MSRP.
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      11-28-2013, 01:36 PM   #59
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I just got a quote for a x5 diesel. Can you guys let me know what you think?
Price 69255
msrp 71000
term 36 mos
rate .00076
residual .61
RES ADDS 2000 (Not sure what this is)
Acq fee 725
MSD $5600
doc fee 80
pmt 855
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      12-01-2013, 11:55 PM   #60
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      12-02-2013, 01:17 AM   #61
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First of all, it will be a wonderful car and no matter what you pay you will love it.

That said, many people on this forum are reporting getting the price on the non-diesels down to just $1,000 or even $500 over invoice. The deal you ask about here is a LONG ways away from that. And there is no reason to expect that the diesel will be "hotter" (and thus harder to get a good deal on) than the non diesel versions. Indeed, on the prior editions of the X5 diesel BMW has seen fit to give a $3,500 "eco credit" to all buyers, ostensibly to help them get make their federally-mandated fleet mileage targets but just as much because demand for the diesel in the US continued to be softer than in Europe.

As for the leasing quoted, hard to judge here without a tad more info: how many miles per year? are you top tier credit worthy? by MSD do you mean multiple security deposits? and what the heck is the "res adds 2000" item?

Again, not to worry in any case - it's only money, and the car will give you satisfaction way beyond it's price.
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      12-02-2013, 06:07 AM   #62
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agreed !

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaw View Post
i need to own my car....can't think of leasing...
after 2 years owning a X3...I needed money...so i sold it for only $14,000 lower than what I had purchased back in 2011... I sold my X3 to my own client but via dealership convenience trade, and saved another $6,000 on the taxes of the new ordered X5...
I have a friend.. has leased a Mercedes...in need of money/hence can't pay the bills, is looking for someone to take over lease (11 months remaining)...holly s...t it's difficult!!! it's been 3 months on the market...not a sole interested...
i sold my X3 in a week...cashed in...settled my debt...ordered a X5...saved additionally on taxes...I don't see any advantage had I leased the X3....
I agree with this guy-- to me a lease is like a time share- (no thank you to both)
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      12-02-2013, 06:54 AM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patrob
Lets say you like to keep the car for longer
That's the thing, the whole purpose of a lease is for those that want a new car every 3 years or so. To keep it longer blows the equation.

Leases are also a better tax advantage, if you're able to write it off as a business expense.
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      12-02-2013, 06:56 AM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BMWdewd
- to me a lease is like a time share- (no thank you to both)
Not really.

A timeshare can actually appreciate over time and it's a long term investment.

An auto lease is simply paying for exactly the use you will get out of a car, for a set (and short) period of time.

I guess you could say they're similar because both involve paying only for the portion you'll use. But one is an investment and one will never appreciate. Both have their advantages, but only if you use them for their intended purpose.
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      12-02-2013, 07:10 AM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shaw
i need to own my car....can't think of leasing...
after 2 years owning a X3...I needed money...so i sold it for only $14,000 lower than what I had purchased back in 2011... I sold my X3 to my own client but via dealership convenience trade, and saved another $6,000 on the taxes of the new ordered X5...
Ok, but something is clearly a little out of the ordinary in this particular case, right? Selling an X3 because you needed cash, then turning around and ordering a (more expensive) X5..

But I do agree if you need to liquidate, a lease isn't the best way to go. BMW has great lease prices because they have great residuals. High residuals won't help you if you want to get out early. That said, I tried to get out of our own X3 after two years because we wanted something bigger, and could have with only a $2k loss (dealer buyout 2k higher than trade-in price). Now 3 months later, I'll get out clean.
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      12-02-2013, 07:37 AM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisny View Post
Ok, but something is clearly a little out of the ordinary in this particular case, right? Selling an X3 because you needed cash, then turning around and ordering a (more expensive) X5..

But I do agree if you need to liquidate, a lease isn't the best way to go. BMW has great lease prices because they have great residuals. High residuals won't help you if you want to get out early. That said, I tried to get out of our own X3 after two years because we wanted something bigger, and could have with only a $2k loss (dealer buyout 2k higher than trade-in price). Now 3 months later, I'll get out clean.
I see your point of question there...I owned the X3... so after selling, I used part of that amount for settling my debt and re-injected the remainder into another financing plan ordering the X5...ofcourse the X5 is more expensive, but I didn't pay additional...whatever I had left from the X3 was put in + tax savings... my installments are as low as lease...I have a residual value (just like lease) that I need to pay at the end(the balloon)...I also have the option to trade-in the car for another if I decide not to pay for that balloon...I can find a buyer outside just like I did for my X3 and sell it for more than the residual value...just like lease...and I've checked both scenarios: a car under finance has a higher residual than a leased one (by around $2,000 to $3,000)...
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