Motor mounts are toast at 60k miles

[acmurda]

Noticed a small oil leak on the driver side. Engine and transmission were completely dry. Narrowed it down to the driver side engine mount, made sense since the fluid was clear and thin confirming it was the hydraulic fluid from the filled mount. While I was under it, found signs of fluid leaking from the right mount also.

My question is, is it normal for them to wear out this early? Car is easy driven, no accidents and the only mod is BMS 1.

[Maverik259]

Originally Posted by acmurda

Noticed a small oil leak on the driver side. Engine and transmission were completely dry. Narrowed it down to the driver side engine mount, made sense since the fluid was clear and thin confirming it was the hydraulic fluid from the filled mount. While I was under it, found signs of fluid leaking from the right mount also.

My question is, is it normal for them to wear out this early? Car is easy driven, no accidents and the only mod is BMS 1.

50i or 35i?

I'm around 70k. Haven't noticed anything but haven't really looked. Where did you first find the fluid! Were you looking for a leak for some reason?

[acmurda]

Originally Posted by Maverik259

50i or 35i?

I'm around 70k. Haven't noticed anything but haven't really looked. Where did you first find the fluid! Were you looking for a leak for some reason?

Its a 35i. I noticed fluid on the garage floor, then started investigating.

[Maverik259]

Originally Posted by acmurda

Its a 35i. I noticed fluid on the garage floor, then started investigating.

Oh wow that's quite the leak then for a motor mount. Never seen a leak that bad before. Glad you figured it out easily enough.

[EnzoCali]

Originally Posted by acmurda

Its a 35i. I noticed fluid on the garage floor, then started investigating.

Same here. Noticed fluid leak and was wondering what the heck could it be now after doing a bunch of good maintenance on it. It turns out it was the right engine mount. I tried removing but was not successful. It looks like it requires a subframe drop, which I'm not equipped to do nor do I want to mess up the alignment. Mechanic quoted me $600 for the job so it might have to be that.

Engine mount bracket seems to be very difficult to remove because of the one bolt in the center. also the exhaust pipe hits the engine bay backside so there's only so much lift you can get on the engine before you realize that you need another 1" or so to pull out the mount and there's nowhere to get it from so back to nothing. It sucks.

[M302_imola]

So the motor mounts are liquid filled?

[yupetc]

Originally Posted by EnzoCali

Same here. Noticed fluid leak and was wondering what the heck could it be now after doing a bunch of good maintenance on it. It turns out it was the right engine mount. I tried removing but was not successful. It looks like it requires a subframe drop, which I'm not equipped to do nor do I want to mess up the alignment. Mechanic quoted me $600 for the job so it might have to be that.

Engine mount bracket seems to be very difficult to remove because of the one bolt in the center. also the exhaust pipe hits the engine bay backside so there's only so much lift you can get on the engine before you realize that you need another 1" or so to pull out the mount and there's nowhere to get it from so back to nothing. It sucks.

Use a cherry-pick and hook the motor from the top (there's a tow-hook access threaded hole right next to the oil-filter housing. Loosen the top nut and you can free up the motor and move it up using the cherry-picker, then remove the motor mount's star-bolt from under the subframe and you're good to go. No need to remove subframe.

[sukhk527]

that’s really odd for such low mileage. seems possible given it’s rubber though.

[acmurda]

Originally Posted by M302_imola

So the motor mounts are liquid filled?

Yes they are fluid charged mounts.

[EnzoCali]

Originally Posted by yupetc

Use a cherry-pick and hook the motor from the top (there's a tow-hook access threaded hole right next to the oil-filter housing. Loosen the top nut and you can free up the motor and move it up using the cherry-picker, then remove the motor mount's star-bolt from under the subframe and you're good to go. No need to remove subframe.

wait, are we talking about the same engine/frame? this is on X5, N55, sdrive35i.
what do you mean remove star bolts on subframe? I mean i can look again but i'm pretty damn sure the motor mount housing is welded to the subframe.
it's like a round cup housing that motor mount is recessed/seated into.
there's no way you can remove it without having enough clearance.

maybe you're thinking different car/engine combo.
this thing is a welded assembly so the only way to remove the motor mount is to go up. to do that you have to have plenty of clearance.
one other suggestion i got was to remove the exhaust to turbo interface to disconnect the exhaust pipe so the engine can be then lifted another 1-2 inches to be able to pull out the mount.
i'm not even sure that removing the engine mount bracket would do much either. it's the exhaust pipe that's hitting, limiting the engine movement upwards to create enough clearance for the mount to be removed.

[yupetc]

Originally Posted by EnzoCali

wait, are we talking about the same engine/frame? this is on X5, N55, sdrive35i.
what do you mean remove star bolts on subframe? I mean i can look again but i'm pretty damn sure the motor mount housing is welded to the subframe.
it's like a round cup housing that motor mount is recessed/seated into.
there's no way you can remove it without having enough clearance.

maybe you're thinking different car/engine combo.
this thing is a welded assembly so the only way to remove the motor mount is to go up. to do that you have to have plenty of clearance.
one other suggestion i got was to remove the exhaust to turbo interface to disconnect the exhaust pipe so the engine can be then lifted another 1-2 inches to be able to pull out the mount.
i'm not even sure that removing the engine mount bracket would do much either. it's the exhaust pipe that's hitting, limiting the engine movement upwards to create enough clearance for the mount to be removed.

My procedure is the following:

There is 1 top nut (hex size is either 19mm or 21mm, I don't remember well) on top of the motor mount, this nut clamps your motor's bracket to the motor mount at the top.

There are two E-torx bolts that clamps the subframe to the motor mount from the bottom side. (Size is likely E12, E14, or E16, I don't recall anymore)

EDIT*: You must remove downpipe completely since you'll be moving the engine up for clearance. Once your motor gets cherry-picked up, the downpipe will limit the degree of freedom, and you won't have enough room to clear for the mounts to be removed from the subframe housing. If you so choose not to do it this way, then go look up how to get it done by lowering the subframe. (Re-commented this paragraph after consideration of ENZOCali's comment)


My steps:
1. Break loose the top hex nut. Can remove the nut completely.

2. Use a cherry pick to hook the motor into suspension. At this initial point, you won't need to really bring the motor up, just make sure you're able to suspend the motor. I'll advise you not to try to lift the motor out of the motor mount's integrated threaded bolt because due to the angle of our motor bracket, you won't likely have the correct clearance. You can get this to free up, but you'll be juking the motor out this way. So hold off.

3. Go from under the car, look at your subframe for those two E-torx bolts for each motor mount. Break those loose and completely remove them.

4. At this point, your motor mount will be loose and ready for removal, but you'll need to play a combination of cherry picking and watching out for sideways movements as you jack that motor up and out. I'm always able to access the mounts and yank them out before the transmission touch the cabin.

5. For new mounts to go in, a common mistake that I run into is I try to secure the mount to the subframe first. If you do it this way, you'll spend hours trying to get the brackets to line up with the top screw of the mount. My best way (100% successful all the time) is to throw both mounts into the subframe box first, then lower the motor just enough so you can maneuver the motor mount upward for the bolt to catch the bracket, spin a few rounds of the top hex nut on and let it dangle, while you're doing this, your mount should be halfway dangling in the subframe's box. You want a loose dangling mount so that as you then lower your motor further into the bay and get to "almost" seating position (even if you have 1/2" spacing is okay).

6. Due to a still-loose motor mount inside the subframe box, you should find it very easy to aim the E-torx bolts from the subframe and insert them into the motor mount. The E-torx bolts are quite long so you should be able to catch the threaded hole. Hand-tighten these E-torx bolts as much as you can, then go back to the cherry pick jack and start lowering the motor into its final seating position. Since you've gotten the top hex nut and the bottom E-torx nuts in, these will smoothly guide the motor back into the subframe box.

7. Tighten everything up to torque spec. You may need to buy a 30" long impact extension to finalize your torque on the top hex nut. It'll make torque wrenching much easier to do.

Note: Steps 5 and 6 involves habitually moving about the car, jacking the motor and and down to align the mount into the subframe box and leave it in a suspending standstill. This is likely the most dangerous and crucial part of your work, so be cognitive of your own work and sequence, try not to get hurt.

The above is as thorough as I can be with this procedure. Hope you all can find this useful.

[tlow98]

Very helpful, thank you yupetc

[EnzoCali]

Originally Posted by yupetc

There are two star bolts that screws the subframe and motor mount together. My procedure is the following:

There is 1 top nut (hex size is either 19mm or 21mm, I don't remember well) on top of the motor mount, this nut clamps your motor's bracket to the motor mount at the top.

There are two E-torx bolts that clamps the subframe to the motor mount from the bottom side. (Size is likely E12, E14, or E16, I don't recall anymore)

Depending on your skills and accessibility from Xdrive or Sdrive form factor, you may consider removing the downpipe completely, if you have after market downpipe, you'll have plenty of room, so just loosen the joint to the midpipe. Once your motor gets picked up, this joint will limit the degree of freedom, so it's best to get this joint loose.


My steps:
1. Break loose the top hex nut. Can remove the nut completely.

2. Use a cherry pick to hook the motor into suspension. At this initial point, you won't need to really bring the motor up, just make sure you're able to suspend the motor. I'll advise you not to try to lift the motor out of the motor mount's integrated threaded bolt because due to the angle of our motor bracket, you won't likely have the correct clearance. You can get this to free up, but you'll be juking the motor out this way. So hold off.

3. Go from under the car, look at your subframe for those two E-torx bolts for each motor mount. Break those loose and completely remove them.

4. At this point, your motor mount will be loose and ready for removal, but you'll need to play a combination of cherry picking and watching out for sideways movements as you jack that motor up and out. I'm always able to access the mounts and yank them out before the transmission touch the cabin.

5. For new mounts to go in, a common mistake that I run into is I try to secure the mount to the subframe first. If you do it this way, you'll spend hours trying to get the brackets to line up with the top screw of the mount. My best way (100% successful all the time) is to throw both mounts into the subframe box first, then lower the motor just enough so you can maneuver the motor mount upward for the bolt to catch the bracket, spin a few rounds of the top hex nut on and let it dangle, while you're doing this, your mount should be halfway dangling in the subframe's box. You want a loose dangling mount so that as you then lower your motor further into the bay and get to "almost" seating position (even if you have 1/2" spacing is okay).

6. Due to a still-loose motor mount inside the subframe box, you should find it very easy to aim the E-torx bolts from the subframe and insert them into the motor mount. The E-torx bolts are quite long so you should be able to catch the threaded hole. Hand-tighten these E-torx bolts as much as you can, then go back to the cherry pick jack and start lowering the motor into its final seating position. Since you've gotten the top hex nut and the bottom E-torx nuts in, these will smoothly guide the motor back into the subframe box.

7. Tighten everything up to torque spec. You may need to buy a 30" long impact extension to finalize your torque on the top hex nut. It'll make torque wrenching much easier to do.

Note: Steps 5 and 6 involves habitually moving about the car, jacking the motor and and down to align the mount into the subframe box and leave it in a suspending standstill. This is likely the most dangerous and crucial part of your work, so be cognitive of your own work and sequence, try not to get hurt.

The above is as thorough as I can be with this procedure. Hope you all can find this useful.

First off, thanks for taking time to detail this out and respond. Ok I think we're on the same page. Now I understand what you are describing.
I really do like the idea about pre-fitting the mounts and letting them ride down with the bracket rather than trying to nail both holes at the same time.
I did run into that issue when I attempted the job last time and had to abord due to clearance and essentially tried doing the same thing with just loose mounts. Now I feel stupid for not just throwing that nut up top to just lock them in place temporarily and let them hang as the engine is lowered.

my downpipe and everything else is stock. exhaust system is a fat sucker and takes up a lot of space. I don't have the cherry picker either, nor too much space in my garage to store bulky tools but I did have pretty good control last time with a regular jack. This time around i think i'll get some bottle jacks to create more space in general vs. a regular jack.
But cherry picker would be a great choice for this operation. having anything else under the car is definitely a space crowding problem but i was so darn close last time. i was like 1" short of taking them out. man, what a pain.
Just a slightly different design on the motor mount housing and it would've been a complete joke to swap them out. These types of things just piss me off about BMW design but it is what it is.

Thanks for the thoughts. I'll print this out and add it to my prep paperwork stash for the next run at it.

Again, I appreciate you taking time to write it all up in detail. 100% legit response, so thanks!

[yupetc]

Originally Posted by EnzoCali

First off, thanks for taking time to detail this out and respond. Ok I think we're on the same page. Now I understand what you are describing.
I really do like the idea about pre-fitting the mounts and letting them ride down with the bracket rather than trying to nail both holes at the same time.
I did run into that issue when I attempted the job last time and had to abord due to clearance and essentially tried doing the same thing with just loose mounts. Now I feel stupid for not just throwing that nut up top to just lock them in place temporarily and let them hang as the engine is lowered.

my downpipe and everything else is stock. exhaust system is a fat sucker and takes up a lot of space. I don't have the cherry picker either, nor too much space in my garage to store bulky tools but I did have pretty good control last time with a regular jack. This time around i think i'll get some bottle jacks to create more space in general vs. a regular jack.
But cherry picker would be a great choice for this operation. having anything else under the car is definitely a space crowding problem but i was so darn close last time. i was like 1" short of taking them out. man, what a pain.
Just a slightly different design on the motor mount housing and it would've been a complete joke to swap them out. These types of things just piss me off about BMW design but it is what it is.

Thanks for the thoughts. I'll print this out and add it to my prep paperwork stash for the next run at it.

Again, I appreciate you taking time to write it all up in detail. 100% legit response, so thanks!

Not a problem at all. This is why we all visit forums. All the hidden tricks are here if we just look hard enough.

If you can't get a cherry picker, get this tool instead:
https://www.harborfreight.com/1000-l...hoCytwQAvD_BwE

Just be weary that our engine bay is on a slightly longer base than this hoist can reach, but with a little bit of finaggling and angle setting, you can still get it to coast and move your motor and and down by turning the hoist's swing nut. A bit slower, but can get the job done.

[EnzoCali]

Originally Posted by yupetc

Not a problem at all. This is why we all visit forums. All the hidden tricks are here if we just look hard enough.

If you can't get a cherry picker, get this tool instead:
https://www.harborfreight.com/1000-l...hoCytwQAvD_BwE

Just be weary that our engine bay is on a slightly longer base than this hoist can reach, but with a little bit of finaggling and angle setting, you can still get it to coast and move your motor and and down by turning the hoist's swing nut. A bit slower, but can get the job done.

thanks. I don't usually buy from HFT unless simple things. So far quality and compatibility has been subpar on multiple levels.
what cherry picker do you use anyway. do you have a link by any chance?

[yupetc]

I got the 1-ton Cherry Picker from Harbor Freight, too. Price has gone up. But for me doing garage work regularly and deal with quite a handful of motor builds, this cherry picker has been one of the best investments in my tool endeavor. Here's the one I got: https://www.harborfreight.com/1-ton-...ane-61858.html


As far as HFT's quality is concerned, you're right, they are inconsistent and I shy away from theirs as much as possible. But on simple mechanical items, I'd buy them again and again because they've been improving a lot lately. But I still wouldn't trust their power tools nor anything heavy in electronics.

[tlow98]

Originally Posted by yupetc

I got the 1-ton Cherry Picker from Harbor Freight, too. Price has gone up. But for me doing garage work regularly and deal with quite a handful of motor builds, this cherry picker has been one of the best investments in my tool endeavor. Here's the one I got: https://www.harborfreight.com/1-ton-...ane-61858.html


As far as HFT's quality is concerned, you're right, they are inconsistent and I shy away from theirs as much as possible. But on simple mechanical items, I'd buy them again and again because they've been improving a lot lately. But I still wouldn't trust their power tools nor anything heavy in electronics.

Agree on this viewpoint of HFT. Any of the things I rarely use or of little technical consequence they are my go-to. But torque wrenches, Milwaukee impacts, and more critical items I don’t get from there.

I love my cherry picker, creeper, and transmission jacks from HFT tho. Rarely used and work great when they are. Their color coded sockets are a bit of genius tho.

[yupetc]

Originally Posted by tlow98

Agree on this viewpoint of HFT. Any of the things I rarely use or of little technical consequence they are my go-to. But torque wrenches, Milwaukee impacts, and more critical items I don’t get from there.

I love my cherry picker, creeper, and transmission jacks from HFT tho. Rarely used and work great when they are. Their color coded sockets are a bit of genius tho.

Exact same here. All my power tools are Milwaukee. I find myself using M12 way more than the M18 platform. Only time I whip out an M18 is to use their mid-torque and high-torque impact wrenches. And that's either doing lug-nuts or removing a crankshaft pulley, other than that, I've always gotten through my jobs with M12 tools. Most of my mechanics tools are bought through Amazon but are in branded names. Then these "I don't care much" tools I go for Harbor Freight.

[EnzoCali]

Originally Posted by yupetc

There are two star bolts that screws the subframe and motor mount together. My procedure is the following:

There is 1 top nut (hex size is either 19mm or 21mm, I don't remember well) on top of the motor mount, this nut clamps your motor's bracket to the motor mount at the top.

There are two E-torx bolts that clamps the subframe to the motor mount from the bottom side. (Size is likely E12, E14, or E16, I don't recall anymore)

Depending on your skills and accessibility from Xdrive or Sdrive form factor, you may consider removing the downpipe completely, if you have after market downpipe, you'll have plenty of room, so just loosen the joint to the midpipe. Once your motor gets picked up, this joint will limit the degree of freedom, so it's best to get this joint loose.


My steps:
1. Break loose the top hex nut. Can remove the nut completely.

2. Use a cherry pick to hook the motor into suspension. At this initial point, you won't need to really bring the motor up, just make sure you're able to suspend the motor. I'll advise you not to try to lift the motor out of the motor mount's integrated threaded bolt because due to the angle of our motor bracket, you won't likely have the correct clearance. You can get this to free up, but you'll be juking the motor out this way. So hold off.

3. Go from under the car, look at your subframe for those two E-torx bolts for each motor mount. Break those loose and completely remove them.

4. At this point, your motor mount will be loose and ready for removal, but you'll need to play a combination of cherry picking and watching out for sideways movements as you jack that motor up and out. I'm always able to access the mounts and yank them out before the transmission touch the cabin.

5. For new mounts to go in, a common mistake that I run into is I try to secure the mount to the subframe first. If you do it this way, you'll spend hours trying to get the brackets to line up with the top screw of the mount. My best way (100% successful all the time) is to throw both mounts into the subframe box first, then lower the motor just enough so you can maneuver the motor mount upward for the bolt to catch the bracket, spin a few rounds of the top hex nut on and let it dangle, while you're doing this, your mount should be halfway dangling in the subframe's box. You want a loose dangling mount so that as you then lower your motor further into the bay and get to "almost" seating position (even if you have 1/2" spacing is okay).

6. Due to a still-loose motor mount inside the subframe box, you should find it very easy to aim the E-torx bolts from the subframe and insert them into the motor mount. The E-torx bolts are quite long so you should be able to catch the threaded hole. Hand-tighten these E-torx bolts as much as you can, then go back to the cherry pick jack and start lowering the motor into its final seating position. Since you've gotten the top hex nut and the bottom E-torx nuts in, these will smoothly guide the motor back into the subframe box.

7. Tighten everything up to torque spec. You may need to buy a 30" long impact extension to finalize your torque on the top hex nut. It'll make torque wrenching much easier to do.

Note: Steps 5 and 6 involves habitually moving about the car, jacking the motor and and down to align the mount into the subframe box and leave it in a suspending standstill. This is likely the most dangerous and crucial part of your work, so be cognitive of your own work and sequence, try not to get hurt.

The above is as thorough as I can be with this procedure. Hope you all can find this useful.

hey yupetc,
just a quick note on #4 above. I think you were talking about doing this work on 535 maybe. I forgot to mention that the mounts cannot be taken out (no clearance) without the exhaust pipe hitting the cabin floor/engine bay wall.
maybe on 535 it's possible but in x5 F15, i tried and verified this already. it's impossible no matter how much clearance you have to pick up the engine, it will be limited by exhaust downpipe.
so the downpipe has to be disconnected before enough clearance can be gained by lifting engine.

just a sidebar note. I think you were talking about 535. This is specific to X5.

[yupetc]

Originally Posted by EnzoCali

hey yupetc,
just a quick note on #4 above. I think you were talking about doing this work on 535 maybe. I forgot to mention that the mounts cannot be taken out (no clearance) without the exhaust pipe hitting the cabin floor/engine bay wall.
maybe on 535 it's possible but in x5 F15, i tried and verified this already. it's impossible no matter how much clearance you have to pick up the engine, it will be limited by exhaust downpipe.
so the downpipe has to be disconnected before enough clearance can be gained by lifting engine.

just a sidebar note. I think you were talking about 535. This is specific to X5.

I do not have a 535, mine's a F15 X535i Xdrive. And the last time I dealt with it is around June of last year, so I vaguely recall all the details. On point #4, I think you may be right, I may already have my downpipe removed to get the job done. Most times when I had to get under the car to do work, I usually bring in a lot more other jobs to do all at the same time. So I may even have pulled out the passenger side front cv axle while at it and rebuilt it. (I did rebuild the CV outer boots for that matter, so I could have done it all in one big go) But good catch, adds more details to hone in the correct procedure. Thanks.

BTW, I have gone ahead and edited the procedure I wrote to include a pre-requisite that you must remove downpipe for the job.

[EnzoCali]

Originally Posted by yupetc

I do not have a 535, mine's a F15 X535i Xdrive. And the last time I dealt with it is around June of last year, so I vaguely recall all the details. On point #4, I think you may be right, I may already have my downpipe removed to get the job done. Most times when I had to get under the car to do work, I usually bring in a lot more other jobs to do all at the same time. So I may even have pulled out the passenger side front cv axle while at it and rebuilt it. (I did rebuild the CV outer boots for that matter, so I could have done it all in one big go) But good catch, adds more details to hone in the correct procedure. Thanks.

BTW, I have gone ahead and edited the procedure I wrote to include a pre-requisite that you must remove downpipe for the job.

thanks. yeah i think we're on the same page. the pipe just hits the underside and there's really no way around it.
i just confirmed in ISTA that someone was nice and helpful enough to share and sure thing the manual has the downpipe disconnected from turbo.
so there goes that. has to be done and it makes sense.
i have to swap out the tension struts on my 535 today but i'll try to get to this engine mount job on my x5 hopefully next week.

by the way, one thing perhaps worth noting is that it might not be needed to really do way too much work with bracket removal and what not.
i removed the passenger side sway bar that runs over airbox/oxsensor lines area to allow engine to have more room to move up. From there just another 2 inches or so is sufficient for the engine lift to get the clearance for the mounts to be removed. unfortunately i did all that work for nothing first time around jsut to realize that pipe's going to be the limiting factor.
this time around, if i disconnect the exhaust i should be able to move the engine up a hair further and get the needed clearance.
another option is to just remove the engine-to-mount brackets.
manual shows 4 etorx bolts but it's honestly a bit puzzling to me because i see 5 of them. the 5th one being dead smack in the center of the bracket, which is impossible to remove without lifting the engine way up. there's just no space for the wrench.
but i'll follow their instructions so we'll see what removing 4 bolts on that bracket will do. maybe removing 4 will allow the bracket to rotate about the 5th bolt without having to remove it. the whole thing is just a funky puzzle but whatever, i'll work through it. Thanks again for quick replies and insights. It's appreciated.

[yupetc]

Originally Posted by EnzoCali

thanks. yeah i think we're on the same page. the pipe just hits the underside and there's really no way around it.
i just confirmed in ISTA that someone was nice and helpful enough to share and sure thing the manual has the downpipe disconnected from turbo.
so there goes that. has to be done and it makes sense.
i have to swap out the tension struts on my 535 today but i'll try to get to this engine mount job on my x5 hopefully next week.

by the way, one thing perhaps worth noting is that it might not be needed to really do way too much work with bracket removal and what not.
i removed the passenger side sway bar that runs over airbox/oxsensor lines area to allow engine to have more room to move up. From there just another 2 inches or so is sufficient for the engine lift to get the clearance for the mounts to be removed. unfortunately i did all that work for nothing first time around jsut to realize that pipe's going to be the limiting factor.
this time around, if i disconnect the exhaust i should be able to move the engine up a hair further and get the needed clearance.
another option is to just remove the engine-to-mount brackets.
manual shows 4 etorx bolts but it's honestly a bit puzzling to me because i see 5 of them. the 5th one being dead smack in the center of the bracket, which is impossible to remove without lifting the engine way up. there's just no space for the wrench.
but i'll follow their instructions so we'll see what removing 4 bolts on that bracket will do. maybe removing 4 will allow the bracket to rotate about the 5th bolt without having to remove it. the whole thing is just a funky puzzle but whatever, i'll work through it. Thanks again for quick replies and insights. It's appreciated.

With my procedure in place, you will not have to deal with the bracket at all. Removing the bracket in the bay is a pain in the ass. Additionally, even if you remove the 4 e-torx bolts and leaving the middle bolt there, you still cannot turn the bracket because the bracket goes in there with some keyed slots. You can install it or remove it, but there's no freedom to turn it due to the slots. No go on the bracket; although technically, yes, you can remove the brackets and get the motor mount out, too. But that to me is a much harder endeavor because you have more bolts to remove in very awkward spacing to access. I cannot imagine the knuckle bleeding I'll be having if I had to go torque all 5 E-torx bolts with my digital torque wrench. That's my $.02