X5 has worst air conditioning system of any car I've ever owned

[Optherion]

Originally Posted by Scott2.0

I live in Phoenix and it’s been pretty decent, but it’s rarely parked in the sun. I wonder if that’s the difference. Or is yours a 35i? Could the smaller engine have a lower capacity compressor?

My vehicle is the 50i.

[gigliosa]

I'd X5-F15 until last year and I'd a similar problem.

Several visit to the bmw assistance without a real issue resolution.

The AC issue is due because the top of the roof is too high vs the passengers heads, so the cold air don't arrive up the top.

To solve, and I assume that this is the fix, you have to put every airtakes fluxing in up direction. Cold air will be pumped first in direction of the roof, than, because the weigth of the cold air, it will go down. (it's a curve with the top at the roof)

I've moved to X6-F16, where the top of the roof is less high, and I've not more the X5-F15 issue.

I hope this will help. (sorry for my english).

[Ex_Stig]

Hey Guys,

I've was active in this thread back in June/July, but since then I kept pretty quiet as I worked through everything. Here are some items that I would like to add to this conversation.

First off, the AC in the X5 definitely has a problem. Those of us in AZ experience it the worst. The problem is worse when the outside temp is over 105. If the car is outside during the summer it will never cool down. Ever.

At first I tried going the dealership route. My dealer told me that, yes, the X5 AC system is the worst of any modern BMW and they get more complaints about it than any other car. Second, they said that BMW is aware of the issue but that it is an "isolated regional issue". Third, they told me to close all rear vents through the idrive system. This isn't really a solution as I have 3 kids and it then makes the sync function totally useless.

At first I tried going through the regular customer service number at BMW NA. I was pretty much told to pound sand (in a very unfriendly way). After that I was given the contact info for someone in the Executive Customer Care department.

I told her that over the last 18 years we have had the following new BMWs:

’98 M Roadster
’98 528i
’01 740iL
’01 M5
’04 745Li
’05 M3
’07 750Li
’10 750Li
’11 M3
’13 750Li
’14 M5
’16 750Li
’17 X5 5.0
’17 X5 5.0

There was 1 Mini in there too, but I don't think it matters. I also told her that I had been one of the biggest BMW advocates in the area. I had loved the brand as well as been an instructor for the BMW CCA.

The contact there was more sympathetic and they started working with the dealership to re-troubleshoot the issue. Time after time BMW came back with the same "operating as designed" response. I kept pressing the matter and started to do my own research. I found that the AC system in the X5 is a much older unit compared to what they use in the X1, X3 and 3 series. My guess is that they never put in a better system, but the interior space of the X5 has grown over the years.

Fast forward 6 weeks of me arguing with BMW NA and they sent a Technical Support Engineer over to my office to discuss the issue. He was a nice guy and explains that in the 7 years he has been with BMW he has only previously met with 1 customer. I am number 2. Basically, his job is to work directly with the dealers to troubleshoot issues.

We had an hour long conversation about the system issues and the constant "operating as designed" response. He was not able to give me an answer of what the system was actually "designed" to do. What I did learn is that he was at the dealership when they tested my system.

The test consists of letting the car sit in the sun (in July in AZ) and then use a meter to see how long it takes to cool down. I found it interesting that in the same sentence that he told me my car passed the test he also said that he and the shop foreman were drenched in sweat by the time the test was over. My goal was to get them to purchase the remainder of our leases (we currently have 2 X5s), but they said they absolutely couldn't do that.

So, what is the real outcome here?

Basically, it is my understanding that BMW is well aware of the AC issue. However, there is no way that they can admit it or fix it. This version of the X5 has been in production since 2014 and there are way too many vehicles for them do do a recall. It is truly disappointing because I really love the X5, but it is pretty much un-drivable in the summer.

Due to our long purchase history with BMW they did make financial amends with us, but they would not entertain any type of buyback or admission that there is a real issue. Before you ask, no, I won't disclose how much we received.

Sadly, this has really soured me on BMW. I am not sure where I will go next, but BMW would have to do something truly amazing to get me to purchase another car from them again.

The only way I see anything happening is if a Class Action lawsuit were to begin. Maybe the Capstone Law group would take the case, they seem to have done this successfully before. See the Porsche class action about windshield glare. https://www.law360.com/articles/8744...ld-glare-suits

Best of luck to everyone with their AC issues.

[DuSh]

Originally Posted by GNALUZU

Hey Guys,

Those of us in AZ experience it the worst. The problem is worse when the outside temp is over 105. If the car is outside during the summer it will never cool down. Ever.

It is truly disappointing because I really love the X5, but it is pretty much un-drivable in the summer.

I'm in Arizona. My x5 50i was absolutely fine when it was 110 here. In fact I constantly have to turn blower down to not catch cold. Either I'm driving a unique x5 made specially for me or...
I also remember you commenting same thing and me replying almost same thing It seems to me we are a bunch of idiots who never learn

[expidia]

Originally Posted by GNALUZU

Hey Guys,

I've was active in this thread back in June/July, but since then I kept pretty quiet as I worked through everything. Here are some items that I would like to add to this conversation.

First off, the AC in the X5 definitely has a problem. Those of us in AZ experience it the worst. The problem is worse when the outside temp is over 105. If the car is outside during the summer it will never cool down. Ever.

At first I tried going the dealership route. My dealer told me that, yes, the X5 AC system is the worst of any modern BMW and they get more complaints about it than any other car. Second, they said that BMW is aware of the issue but that it is an "isolated regional issue". Third, they told me to close all rear vents through the idrive system. This isn't really a solution as I have 3 kids and it then makes the sync function totally useless.

At first I tried going through the regular customer service number at BMW NA. I was pretty much told to pound sand (in a very unfriendly way). After that I was given the contact info for someone in the Executive Customer Care department.

I told her that over the last 18 years we have had the following new BMWs:

’98 M Roadster
’98 528i
’01 740iL
’01 M5
’04 745Li
’05 M3
’07 750Li
’10 750Li
’11 M3
’13 750Li
’14 M5
’16 750Li
’17 X5 5.0
’17 X5 5.0

There was 1 Mini in there too, but I don't think it matters. I also told her that I had been one of the biggest BMW advocates in the area. I had loved the brand as well as been an instructor for the BMW CCA.

The contact there was more sympathetic and they started working with the dealership to re-troubleshoot the issue. Time after time BMW came back with the same "operating as designed" response. I kept pressing the matter and started to do my own research. I found that the AC system in the X5 is a much older unit compared to what they use in the X1, X3 and 3 series. My guess is that they never put in a better system, but the interior space of the X5 has grown over the years.

Fast forward 6 weeks of me arguing with BMW NA and they sent a Technical Support Engineer over to my office to discuss the issue. He was a nice guy and explains that in the 7 years he has been with BMW he has only previously met with 1 customer. I am number 2. Basically, his job is to work directly with the dealers to troubleshoot issues.

We had an hour long conversation about the system issues and the constant "operating as designed" response. He was not able to give me an answer of what the system was actually "designed" to do. What I did learn is that he was at the dealership when they tested my system.

The test consists of letting the car sit in the sun (in July in AZ) and then use a meter to see how long it takes to cool down. I found it interesting that in the same sentence that he told me my car passed the test he also said that he and the shop foreman were drenched in sweat by the time the test was over. My goal was to get them to purchase the remainder of our leases (we currently have 2 X5s), but they said they absolutely couldn't do that.

So, what is the real outcome here?

Basically, it is my understanding that BMW is well aware of the AC issue. However, there is no way that they can admit it or fix it. This version of the X5 has been in production since 2014 and there are way too many vehicles for them do do a recall. It is truly disappointing because I really love the X5, but it is pretty much un-drivable in the summer.

Due to our long purchase history with BMW they did make financial amends with us, but they would not entertain any type of buyback or admission that there is a real issue. Before you ask, no, I won't disclose how much we received.

Sadly, this has really soured me on BMW. I am not sure where I will go next, but BMW would have to do something truly amazing to get me to purchase another car from them again.

The only way I see anything happening is if a Class Action lawsuit were to begin. Maybe the Capstone Law group would take the case, they seem to have done this successfully before. See the Porsche class action about windshield glare. https://www.law360.com/articles/8744...ld-glare-suits

Best of luck to everyone with their AC issues.

Thx for your taking the time and coming back to this thread to explain what you found so far.
Let me say its an honor to hear your opinions especially from someone who has owned and experienced an amazing 15 or so BMW's.

It amazes me how so many of us have had poor experience with this AC system, yet there are so many who pop in with and feel the need to tell us that "they have had no issues or think the AC system is great".
Don't know why posters have that need to do that when others are suffering with the subpar operation of an AC system for such a line of high priced luxury cars.

Before I bought mine a check of the ratings in consumer reports only had two negatives or weak spots complied from the feedback of thousands of owners with the X5 years.

The two were body fit and the audio system. I can agree with the audio system as I only have the basic system and for a 65k MSRP its pretty piss poor.
My Wife's Audi Q5 blows mine away! Even the higher end audio systems have a lot of negative feedback in various BMW forums.

Glad to hear they compensated you but that doesn't help how great the overall X5 is yet for you with the Arizona temps . . . its a deal breaker.

Start a class action suit. Sadly, thats the only thing these unresponsive corporations understand . . . . and sign me up

[DuSh]

Originally Posted by expidia

Thx for your taking the time and coming back to this thread to explain what you found so far.
Let me say its an honor to hear your opinions especially from someone who has owned and experienced an amazing 15 or so BMW's.

It amazes me how so many of us have had poor experience with this AC system, yet there are so many who pop in with and feel the need to tell us that "they have had no issues or think the AC system is great".
Don't know why posters have that need to do that when others are suffering with the subpar operation of an AC system for such a line of high priced luxury cars.

Before I bought mine a check of the ratings in consumer reports only had two negatives or weak spots complied from the feedback of thousands of owners with the X5 years.

The two were body fit and the audio system. I can agree with the audio system as I only have the basic system and for a 65k MSRP its pretty piss poor.
My Wife's Audi Q5 blows mine away! Even the higher end audio systems have a lot of negative feedback in various BMW forums.

Glad to hear they compensated you but that doesn't help how great the overall X5 is yet for you with the Arizona temps . . . its a deal breaker.

Start a class action suit. Sadly, thats the only thing these unresponsive corporations understand . . . . and sign me up

Hey man, I'm not trying to offend anyone here, I'm just trying to put another side of story to the table. Only that way we can get to the bottom of this.
Clearly this issue is present in some x5s, but not in others. This is symptomatic of a bad batch or a specific defect that requires a recall of a sort or similar action to make it right with customers. I can also say that clearly GNALUZU and anyone who thinks that "...it's just a weak AC and that cabin size has grown over time and that's why AC is not enough..." - it's just plain wrong. My AC works absolutely fine and I'm fed up with this BS of people not seeing it this way and thinking it's something that ALL x5s have. I'm ordering a thermometer from amazon and I will conduct a test with AC in Arizona and upload a video. Whatever the results will be - we can at least discuss them, but I'm not used to believe to some guy on a forum who "thinks" he knows the secret of why AC in x5 is so weak. I like facts, not rumors or objective opinions

[Ex_Stig]

Originally Posted by DuSh

Hey man, I'm not trying to offend anyone here, I'm just trying to put another side of story to the table. Only that way we can get to the bottom of this.
Clearly this issue is present in some x5s, but not in others. This is symptomatic of a bad batch or a specific defect that requires a recall of a sort or similar action to make it right with customers. I can also say that clearly GNALUZU and anyone who thinks that "...it's just a weak AC and that cabin size has grown over time and that's why AC is not enough..." - it's just plain wrong. My AC works absolutely fine and I'm fed up with this BS of people not seeing it this way and thinking it's something that ALL x5s have. I'm ordering a thermometer from amazon and I will conduct a test with AC in Arizona and upload a video. Whatever the results will be - we can at least discuss them, but I'm not used to believe to some guy on a forum who "thinks" he knows the secret of why AC in x5 is so weak. I like facts, not rumors or objective opinions

Testing now won?t really do anything. You are gonna have to wait until next summer.

My ac works okay now that the temps are only in the upper 80s / low 90s.

As for whether I am right or not, ask yourself this...

Why would BMW NA write two checks the size they did if nothing was wrong with the AC system in the X5?

[SCA]

Originally Posted by GNALUZU

Why would BMW NA write two checks the size they did if nothing was wrong with the AC system in the X5?

I suspect that BMW NA required you to sign and notarize a ‘General Release’ prior to cutting any checks?

[Ex_Stig]

Originally Posted by SCA

I suspect that BMW NA required you to sign and notarize a ‘General Release’ prior to cutting any checks?

No, they did not. They described it as a gesture of goodwill for our loyalty to the brand.

[Chadmatic]

Originally Posted by GNALUZU

Due to our long purchase history with BMW they did make financial amends with us, but they would not entertain any type of buyback or admission that there is a real issue. Before you ask, no, I won't disclose how much we received.

Sadly, this has really soured me on BMW. I am not sure where I will go next, but BMW would have to do something truly amazing to get me to purchase another car from them again.

The only way I see anything happening is if a Class Action lawsuit were to begin. Maybe the Capstone Law group would take the case, they seem to have done this successfully before. See the Porsche class action about windshield glare. https://www.law360.com/articles/8744...ld-glare-suits

I'm a little confused, BMW made "financial amends" with you and this has really soured you on BMW?

I must be missing something... because it appears that they have performed extensive tests and found no issues with your AC. They are going above and beyond by throwing you a little bone in the spirit of "the customer is always right" (even though they are not always right), it is not necessarily an admission of guilt in my opinion, just incredible customer service.

[Ex_Stig]

Originally Posted by Chadmatic

I'm a little confused, BMW made "financial amends" with you and this has really soured you on BMW?

I must be missing something... because it appears that they have performed extensive tests and found no issues with your AC. They are going above and beyond by throwing you a little bone in the spirit of "the customer is always right" (even though they are not always right), it is not necessarily an admission of guilt in my opinion, just incredible customer service.

The financial amends are not enough to cover the gap between the remaining payments + residual vs the current value.

So, yes, they cut me a couple checks, but I am still stuck with both X5s.

The frustrating part is the admission from everyone up to and including the Service Director at my dealership that BMW is in fact aware of the problem and that yes, there is a problem.

[doormouse]

from all the posts and my experience with my new 17 35i, it appears the rear AC control option (luxury seating) is one of the primary contributors for the poor AC cooling. I also agree the front windshield and windows expose a ton heat in this vehicle based on size. I’m in SoCal and on hot days 95+ it just doesn’t seem to cool as quick as other vehicles I’ve owned.

Love the car, my remedy is going to just tint the front windshield and driver/passenger windows. And when no one is in backseat I disable the rear AC control (it’s now a smart preset...).

[Chadmatic]

Originally Posted by expidia

It amazes me how so many of us have had poor experience with this AC system, yet there are so many who pop in with and feel the need to tell us that "they have had no issues or think the AC system is great".
Don't know why posters have that need to do that when others are suffering with the subpar operation of an AC system for such a line of high priced luxury cars.

Isn't that the whole idea behind this forum? To share our opinions, experiences and knowledge.

Originally Posted by doormouse

from all the posts and my experience with my new 17 35i, it appears the rear AC control option (luxury seating) is one of the primary contributors for the poor AC cooling. I also agree the front windshield and windows expose a ton heat in this vehicle based on size. I’m in SoCal and on hot days 95+ it just doesn’t seem to cool as quick as other vehicles I’ve owned.

Love the car, my remedy is going to just tint the front windshield and driver/passenger windows. And when no one is in backseat I disable the rear AC control (it’s now a smart preset...).

Also in Southern California and despite the heat we have had this summer, I often have to turn AC to lowest setting or sometimes off because the cabin gets so cold.

[SCA]

Originally Posted by GNALUZU

No, they did not. They described it as a gesture of goodwill for our loyalty to the brand.

Well aware of the “goodwill due to loyalty of the brand” as a multiple BMW owner of thirty years, but there is a general release they use as well. Consider yourself even more fortunate that you did not have to sign one because if you had you would not be divulging the specifics via a public forum without legal action.

Customer agrees not to reveal the facts leading to the terms or the conditions of this General Release in any communication form, including, but not limited to, word-of-mouth, print, broadcast, or Internet.

Hopefully the monetary value you received was pleasing.

[Ex_Stig]

Originally Posted by SCA

Well aware of the “goodwill due to loyalty of the brand” as a multiple BMW owner of thirty years, but there is a general release they use as well. Consider yourself even more fortunate that you did not have to sign one because if you had you would not be divulging the specifics via a public forum without legal action.

Customer agrees not to reveal the facts leading to the terms or the conditions of this General Release in any communication form, including, but not limited to, word-of-mouth, print, broadcast, or Internet.

Hopefully the monetary value you received was pleasing.

Oh, I am definitely aware. The only reason I am sharing my info is because they did not make me sign one.

I was fully expecting them to request it.

[deutsch100]

I am on X5 #7. Last was a 2017 X5 40e and current is an X5 35d. 40e had decent A/C, and I feel the 35d is a tad better. I do not think in general BMW has great A/C.

A big part of why the car is SO hard to cool down, is that BMW does not use, nor offer UV glass on the X5. The glass gets so hot, and then the cabin cannot cool down! Park the X5 in the sun, and then get in, drive even with A/C to Max and touch the front glass. Scalding. It just keeps heating the cabin.

We have had probably 50 new cars in the last 20 years, and the best A/C in any make and model, including Rolls-Royce and Bentley, has been and is Range Rover and Ford. Just amazing HVAC. Bentley and BMW seem to be the weakest..not awful, but just not great!

But, I really believe it is BMWs inferior auto glass. Our 5 RRs (3 Phantoms and 2 Ghosts) obviously had BMW HVAC, and the airflow volume was low(ish) but the windscreen and all side and rear glass was UV/heat blocking. It made all the difference in the world. Within mins the interior of the Phantoms (which is HUGE btw) and the Ghosts (think BIG 7 Series) would be ice cold!!

[expidia]

[QUOTE=Chadmatic;22262926]Isn't that the whole idea behind this forum? To share our opinions, experiences and knowledge.

There is a difference between sharing ideas and suggesting "the OP is an idiot because he does not agree with your view" especially if you are one of the lucky ones that don't feel there is any issue with BMW's climate control system over most other cheaper vehicles.

I agree with the OP so I too must be an idiot

Oh ya, and this AC thread has over 10,0000 views and posts probably because so many BMW owners are so happy with the performance of their HVAC in a 65K plus luxury vehicle!

[Optherion]

Going to get my windshield tinted next week with Some UV protection. I noticed how insanely hot the dash gets when I remove my sunshade and run errands.

Someone mentioned the Range Rover dual pane glass. I can attest that glass is amazing at how little heat is let into the cabin and the door sills are not nearly as hot. Of course I have no readings to go by other than my hand, but it was enough to make me jealous.

Now I'm starting to wonder about my giant sun roof as also being a major contributing factor to interior heat.

[expidia]

And . . . those comments above were directly from "the guy who used to be "the most interesting Guy in the World". . . I doubt he would steer us wrong.

"Stay cool, my friends"

[BimmerX5kid]

Checks being written to customers cannot in any way shape or form be construed as a problem, lack of problem or admission of guilt or denial of guilt. I have experience working at executive level of a large retail corporation. It is eye popping how many times "make this go away" money is disbursed. It's not considered "settlement" money. It's "leave us alone" money

[LowerEast]

[QUOTE=expidia;22265951]

Originally Posted by Chadmatic

Isn't that the whole idea behind this forum? To share our opinions, experiences and knowledge.

There is a difference between sharing ideas and suggesting "the OP is an idiot because he does not agree with your view" especially if you are one of the lucky ones that don't feel there is any issue with BMW's climate control system over most other cheaper vehicles.

I agree with the OP so I too must be an idiot

Oh ya, and this AC thread has over 10,0000 views and posts probably because so many BMW owners are so happy with the performance of their HVAC in a 65K plus luxury vehicle!

Where are the posts suggesting people who have an issue with their AC are idiots?

I think people sharing that their systems are working fine and keeping their cars cool is helpful as an indication that it's perhaps not (entirely) the design of the system, but rather that there may be an issue with how it is operating in some cars. Maybe there's a problem in how some units have been assembled that is fixable. Maybe BMW sources components from multiple suppliers and it's the luck of the draw if your car gets the good ones or bad ones. Maybe it's something else.

If the fact that someone else's AC is working well while yours is not makes you feel like an idiot, that feeling probably says more about you than it does about them.

[Ex_Stig]

Originally Posted by Optherion

Going to get my windshield tinted next week with Some UV protection. I noticed how insanely hot the dash gets when I remove my sunshade and run errands.

Someone mentioned the Range Rover dual pane glass. I can attest that glass is amazing at how little heat is let into the cabin and the door sills are not nearly as hot. Of course I have no readings to go by other than my hand, but it was enough to make me jealous.

Now I'm starting to wonder about my giant sun roof as also being a major contributing factor to interior heat.

Yeah, the enormous sunroof is definitely a problem in the summer. Just touching the roof when the shade is closed is extremely hot. Basically, the car has a big problem with the Greenhouse effect.

I hope the UV tint on the windshield works. I'd love to get the sunroof tinted even darker (limo tint), but I've heard some horror stories about the glass shattering during installation.