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      04-27-2017, 09:38 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by Flying Ace View Post
confused...did the F15 have the first year model issues?

My first year model M3 didn't have any unique issues...my near final model year X5 has the same issues as the models 4 years older. All my issues with BMWs has been endemic to the entire model/powertrain range.

The only thing I can think of in recent memory that had early model issues was the N54 fuel pump fiasco, and that took 2-3 years to phase out with the N55 IIRC.

Is this the bogeyman of fearful BMW owners?
The first year model nightmare is not exclusive to BMW or any one manufacturer. Just imagine a manufacturer test a few cars and fix some bobbles then they launch the vehicle to the masses who drive under everyday circumstances and situations...the problems tend to grow exponentially; with possibly 10s of thousands of vehicles on the road many new problems come to the surface. It's the first year test of thousands of vehicle instead of just a few pre-launch.
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      04-27-2017, 10:27 AM   #24
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first year of new model is real world beta-testing.
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      04-27-2017, 10:40 AM   #25
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I'm just reading a lot of hearsay and theory here on first year models....I stand by my point from my experience
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      04-27-2017, 10:55 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying Ace View Post
I'm just reading a lot of hearsay and theory here on first year models....I stand by my point from my experience
Looks like you have limited experience then, because others who have had experiences as well beg to differ.. myself included. As mentioned above, 1st year model car owners are beta testers with warranty. Now this doesn't mean that every single first year model car that leaves the production line will have problems... apparently your M3 wasn't affected... you are having that if it didn't happen to me then it shouldn't happen to anyone else syndrome. But this is common knowledge in the automotive world... I guess you just missed the memo.
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      04-27-2017, 12:02 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kzang View Post
Looks like you have limited experience then, because others who have had experiences as well beg to differ.. myself included. As mentioned above, 1st year model car owners are beta testers with warranty. Now this doesn't mean that every single first year model car that leaves the production line will have problems... apparently your M3 wasn't affected... you are having that if it didn't happen to me then it shouldn't happen to anyone else syndrome. But this is common knowledge in the automotive world... I guess you just missed the memo.
I do concede that the M3 was at its time the most statistically defect free car in the BMW lineup. I read some breakdown of the JD Power initial quality survey of new car ownership (today it's a paid service to dive into the details), but the M3's numbers were in line with the entire Lexus lineup at the time, and was the most defect-free car in the entire BMW line up.
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      04-27-2017, 12:04 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iconoclast View Post
F15 wasn't exactly a new X5 it was a reincarnation of the E70 or a substantial "facelift" if you wanted to go that far.
except bmw broke the steering on the F15.
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      04-27-2017, 01:25 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying Ace View Post
I do concede that the M3 was at its time the most statistically defect free car in the BMW lineup. I read some breakdown of the JD Power initial quality survey of new car ownership (today it's a paid service to dive into the details), but the M3's numbers were in line with the entire Lexus lineup at the time, and was the most defect-free car in the entire BMW line up.
Except for that little issue with rod bearings. . Initial quality yes.
My 11 M3 has been 100% trouble free and the most defect free vehicle I have ever owned. But I'm only at 12k miles.
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      04-27-2017, 01:34 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by mermar View Post
Except for that little issue with rod bearings. . Initial quality yes.
My 11 M3 has been 100% trouble free and the most defect free vehicle I have ever owned. But I'm only at 12k miles.
endemic to all s65 AND s85 motors. So not a 2008 model year issue. That was my point. Plus that survey I'm talking about was a 2011 survey, so that was before the current hysteria.
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      04-27-2017, 09:02 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying Ace View Post
I'm just reading a lot of hearsay and theory here on first year models....I stand by my point from my experience
I had a first year Q5 and my father had a first year Q7. They both came with alot of issues compared to the later year models.
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      04-27-2017, 09:41 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying Ace View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by mermar View Post
Except for that little issue with rod bearings. . Initial quality yes.
My 11 M3 has been 100% trouble free and the most defect free vehicle I have ever owned. But I'm only at 12k miles.
endemic to all s65 AND s85 motors. So not a 2008 model year issue. That was my point. Plus that survey I'm talking about was a 2011 survey, so that was before the current hysteria.
We can agree to disagree. The majority of us enthusiast and owners of these machines are well aware of the first year model issues. It's practically impossible to solve every issue through the limited testing of a few mules. I've had different brands first years and they've all had 1 issue or another. I expect it as do many others. Won't stop me from purchasing the brand's offering just not buying the first year...I'll leave that to those who must have the latest greatest and sit back and watch the endless complaints to be fixed and resolved for the later runs off the production line with the majority of the fixes already handled. Saves headaches and trips to the service center....but drive on have a good time and live life to the fullest! Ha!
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      04-27-2017, 10:09 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IvanLZ View Post
I had a first year Q5 and my father had a first year Q7. They both came with alot of issues compared to the later year models.
Quote:
Originally Posted by beammeupscottie View Post
We can agree to disagree. The majority of us enthusiast and owners of these machines are well aware of the first year model issues. It's practically impossible to solve every issue through the limited testing of a few mules. I've had different brands first years and they've all had 1 issue or another. I expect it as do many others. Won't stop me from purchasing the brand's offering just not buying the first year...I'll leave that to those who must have the latest greatest and sit back and watch the endless complaints to be fixed and resolved for the later runs off the production line with the majority of the fixes already handled. Saves headaches and trips to the service center....but drive on have a good time and live life to the fullest! Ha!

Again, I'm talking specifically about BMWs here...Still waiting for concrete evidence.

I suppose someone said "alot" of F15 owners were getting CELs early. Not enough information though. 35i? 50i? D?
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      04-28-2017, 07:34 AM   #34
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E46 M3 rod bearings, E9x HPFP, E9X DCT issues, F8X Drive Shaft and Subframe bolts. Just off the top of my head but in general I like to avoid first year new model and that is not BMW exclusive... All marques.
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      04-28-2017, 09:18 AM   #35
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My 2014 35i has been problem - free. I believe the 35i is reliable and solid.

Most complains were coming from 50i and 35d owners.
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      04-28-2017, 09:46 AM   #36
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You can go back to posts back when the F15 just came out and you can see what we are talking about. Its not limited to BMW or just the X5 either.
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      04-28-2017, 09:51 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan l. View Post
You can go back to posts back when the F15 just came out and you can see what we are talking about. Its not limited to BMW or just the X5 either.
Yup.... Flying Ace this thread Post Your F15 Issues Here..........

http://f15.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=970052

is stickied for a reason
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      04-28-2017, 05:40 PM   #38
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^ I briefly skimmed the thread. Not many pages considering it's 3.5 years old now. What I gathered is, issues are consistently found through out the years 2014-today. I don't see a lot of common issues other than "interior rattles".

I'm still not convinced on the 1st year model bug specifically with BMWs or F15s. Again the only past issue in recent memory that may be able support your theory that this effects BMWs would be the N54 fuel pump issue...maybe. But that's a N54 issue, not a E9x or something issue...You buy a N54 regardless of year, you're screwed (until they fixed it). Same with N63.


Now those who claim this happens with Audis and what not I believe you....but not through my experience with BMWs.

As others have said, at least with the F15, it wasn't a major change under the skin. Same transmissions (except for the D), same motors, slight tweaks to turbos, new FRM, new navi... it's not like Volvo or Jaguar coming out with a brand spanking new concept of the XC90 or F-type where most everything is new.
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      04-28-2017, 07:18 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying Ace View Post
^ I briefly skimmed the thread. Not many pages considering it's 3.5 years old now. What I gathered is, issues are consistently found through out the years 2014-today. I don't see a lot of common issues other than "interior rattles".

I'm still not convinced on the 1st year model bug specifically with BMWs or F15s. Again the only past issue in recent memory that may be able support your theory that this effects BMWs would be the N54 fuel pump issue...maybe. But that's a N54 issue, not a E9x or something issue...You buy a N54 regardless of year, you're screwed (until they fixed it). Same with N63.


Now those who claim this happens with Audis and what not I believe you....but not through my experience with BMWs.

As others have said, at least with the F15, it wasn't a major change under the skin. Same transmissions (except for the D), same motors, slight tweaks to turbos, new FRM, new navi... it's not like Volvo or Jaguar coming out with a brand spanking new concept of the XC90 or F-type where most everything is new.
It happens with EVERY make and model. Consider yourself lucky and move on.
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      04-28-2017, 09:56 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CINISI View Post
It happens with EVERY make and model. Consider yourself lucky and move on.
....Fine, but we're not talking about EVERY make and model here are we?
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      04-28-2017, 10:13 PM   #41
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It happens with EVERY make and model. Consider yourself lucky and move on.
"Consider yourself lucky and move on." ...THAT's your 3rd post?
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      04-29-2017, 05:41 PM   #42
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"Consider yourself lucky and move on." ...THAT's your 3rd post?
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      04-29-2017, 06:21 PM   #43
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The F15 had assorted electronic gremlins when it released but it was more reliable than some past first year BMWs I've had. Oddly enough, my 2017 has some issues since iDrive was upgraded. I need to take it in for another update.
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      04-29-2017, 06:43 PM   #44
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the f15 shared a lot of parts with the e70, so its not as bad as some of you say. the engines and drivetrains are a carry over for the most part from the e70.
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