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      02-04-2014, 09:06 PM   #1
Aviator_JPN
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xDrive 35i vs. 35d

Hello,

I've been shopping around cars and decided to go with X5. I'm debating to get either 35i or 35d. I thought I could get your advise/input on the following. I'm planning to own it for probably 10yrs or so. Btw, I live in DFW/Texas area.

1. Maintenance/repair cost: Which is more expensive on Mx/Repair?
2. Maintenance Program Upgrade: $2,295 worth to purchase? or cheaper to maintain w/o it?
3. Resale value: Which has better resale value (in US)?
4. Any turbo/accerelation lag on 35d? I test drove ML350 Diesel. There was noticiable lag.
5. Is the quality/durability of X5 good enough to own it for long years? (10yrs).

At this point, I don't see the benefit of 35d in our area as the diesel is more expensive than gas (about 25c higher). And if my calculation is correct, it would take somewhere between 50K miles and 190K miles to be break-even (avg=120K miles). But if the resale value is higher and maintenance/repair cost is lower on 35d, I would like to consider 35d as I'm sure I will be impressed by the torque it has.

Thanks in advance for your support!

AJ
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      02-05-2014, 08:08 AM   #2
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35i vs. 35d

1. Maintenance/repair cost: Which is more expensive on Mx/Repair?
2. Maintenance Program Upgrade: $2,295 worth to purchase? or cheaper to maintain w/o it?
3. Resale value: Which has better resale value (in US)?
4. Any turbo/accerelation lag on 35d? I test drove ML350 Diesel. There was noticiable lag.
5. Is the quality/durability of X5 good enough to own it for long years? (10yrs).

I have ordered a 35d, so I will share my thinking, and will know a lot more after the car actually arrives...lol
1) very hard to say, but, like you, I keep my cars a long time (currently have a 2003 Z4 that has 130,000 and which has had very few maintenance issues), but am a boater and diesels always have had better resale for their durability and superior gas mileage. I agree with you, the current 10% premium over premium gasoline combined with the 20-25% better gas mileage probably means a long payback period for the added fuel economy.
2) I have been led to believe that the price for the extended maintenance program does not go up very much if you just wait until closer to the time when regular warranty expires, and so you can invest the money you don't spend now, and buy it later.
3) relative resale value of diesel versus gas years down the road--no idea, but logic would say yes, especially if gasoline prices are higher and therefore added fuel economy worth more to new buyer
4) I test drove other BMW diesels and didn't notice much lag
5) As I mentioned, of course depends on how much and how hard you drive it, but in a southern climate, I can't imagine why you would get at least 10 virtually trouble free years.
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      02-05-2014, 11:59 AM   #3
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Thanks, Michiganian for your comment!
Hope this winter weather is not troubling you much. It's cold in Dallas today. It's still in high 20s....

As for the maintenance upgrade, can I buy it later down the road w/o raised price? If yes, I won't definitely buy it when I place my order!

Lastly,congrats on the order of 35D! Let me know how your driving experience is with 35D when you receive one!

Stay warm and safe!
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      02-05-2014, 06:38 PM   #4
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For me the diesel is just a better all around driving experience. I have a 2011 35d and just ordered a new 35d. The low end torque of the diesel just makes the driving experience so calm and relaxed. You don't need to rev the motor out to pass cars etc. Go drive a current X35 d and i and see which you prefer...

To answer your questions...

1. Maintenance/repair cost: Which is more expensive on Mx/Repair? SHOULD BE THE SAME.
2. Maintenance Program Upgrade: $2,295 worth to purchase? or cheaper to maintain w/o it? ALL DEPENDS ON YOUR DRIVING STYLE. I GO THROUGH BRAKES A LOT. I THINK THAT IS BECAUSE OF TRAFFIC AND I DRIVE OVER A HILL EVERY DAY IN MY COMMUTE.
3. Resale value: Which has better resale value (in US)? DIESEL SHOULD HAVE BETTER RESALE. IT IS THE MOST POPULAR X5 MODEL.
4. Any turbo/accerelation lag on 35d? I test drove ML350 Diesel. There was noticiable lag. LAG IS MINIMAL. I HAVE NOT DRIVEN THE NEW X5 D BUT DID DRIVE THE 535D and noticed virtually no lag.
5. Is the quality/durability of X5 good enough to own it for long years? (10yrs). I THINK SO. IF YOU MAINTAIN IT.
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      02-05-2014, 11:02 PM   #5
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Radelow,

Thanks a lot for your input. I will definitely try out 35d when available to drive in DFW area. When I drove ML350 in gas and diesel, it was obvious that I liked the diesel better because of the torque and it was extremly quiet inside while I heard the diesel noise when I was outside of the car.

Enjoy your new 35d!
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      02-06-2014, 01:52 PM   #6
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I would go with the D and they are available to drive.
It is quiter then previous generation and the transmission in this one makes it soooo much better. I have one on order myself.
Dennis
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      02-06-2014, 02:45 PM   #7
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I went for Diesel...
Reasons:
I've driven diesel cars for a decade in Europe...always happy...I purchased my first 2 gasoline cars in Canada...big consumption difference!!!
So don't only look at the price per gallon...also consider consumption...with gasoline, you will be visiting a gas station more often than a diesel...even with the most efficient of vehicles...
Diesel engines are more durable with less maintenance...but a bit more complex...I still wouldn't worry about it as the level of know-how on advanced diesel engines are well along the way...
regarding the acceleration/lag, I believe the much stronger torque well compensates... the 35d torque is near a 50i...
marketing perspective: Diesel is still growing in NorAm. So it pays off to buy a car that is environmentally/economically appreciated...easier to sell (IMO).
BMW in general has a much better resale value compared to its rivals...also Diesel is $1,500 more expensive...there is a reason for it...
hope this helps...
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      02-06-2014, 03:55 PM   #8
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Diesel here as well. Been wanting a diesel for a while and i believe the 35d offers what I am looking for, excellent range and good towing capacity. I have driven the F15 35i but not the 35d. I did drive a '14 535d (same drivetrain as the X5 35d) and came away very impressed. Quiet, smooth, and you can feel the torque in the seat of the pants. Granted, the 535d is around 700lbs. lighter. The first F15 35d that I drive will be my own since it's being built this week but I am confident it will tow better than the 35i and be more efficient as well.
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      02-06-2014, 04:44 PM   #9
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Loving Diesel

I've had mine for 5 days / 400 miles. It's quick, nice torque, a little louder from outside than gas enginer, but not noticeable inside.
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      02-06-2014, 05:35 PM   #10
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I just traded a 2010 35d and am going back to gas with a 35i. I did love the diesel, torque is nice, but I went from a 2007 X5 with the 6 cyl engine which was not enough power. The idle noise is not bad, but there is some. If you try to drive the diesel sporty, the initial lag at times was irritating. The fact the new 35i gets 1 more mpg hwy than my old diesel made my decision, I know the new d is 4 mpg better on hwy. The up front cost and the higher diesel fuel cost, was 40 cents recently, made the the even better mpg on the F15 a bit of a wash. In the end I just wanted to go a little more sporty, and the 35i is quicker than the d. Really can't go wrong with either. One caveat, I drove the d pretty tame, so if I drive this one harder, the mpg difference will be greater
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      02-06-2014, 11:48 PM   #11
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Thanks, guys.

I found the following article on the MPG of gas vs diesel. Wonder if Diesel MPG on the article is true or not.... Looking forward to testing out 35d this weekend!

"My experience is that gas-engine cars come close to the EPA ratings. Every diesel engine car I’ve driven does better on highway mileage than the EPA highway rating, and that’s usually without trying. Most recently, I got 50 mpg highway in a just-manufactured, not-broken-in Chevrolet Cruze diesel (EPA highway rating 46 mpg), just over 50 mpg in a BMW 328d (EPA highway rating 43 mpg), and 38 mpg mostly highway driving in an Audi A8L TDI diesel (EPA highway rating 34 mpg). In general, I found hybrids when I drove them to get a bit less than the EPA ratings and they also seemed more affected by driver behavior."

http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/1...-environment/2
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      02-16-2014, 04:12 PM   #12
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Good thread - thanks - moving on from Range Rover and this forum is full of great information.
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      02-16-2014, 04:42 PM   #13
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I drove a F15 35d last week that a local dealer hadn't pre-sold (seems like most allocations are getting filled as soon as available) so the first 35d that I have driven is not my own like I thought it would be. Very smooth and quiet on the inside and instantaneous throttle response. While it doesn't feel fast, it certainly feels strong and capable and like mentioned earlier in this thread gets it done in an unflappable manner. I am happy with my choice to go with diesel and my wait should be short (produced week six) and should be here in 2-3 weeks.
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      02-16-2014, 05:18 PM   #14
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The Europeans have had diesel for decades and the technology is fairly refined over the years. NA sees diesel in slightly different light, partly because the diesel fuel is more expensive than petrol. But this is offset by the MPG.

Our last X5 we ordered 4.4I. At that time the 3.0I didn't have sufficient power, IMO. We ordered diesel this time to be more greener.(electric on large vehicles just don't work, again IMO) The torque and fuel efficiency are also nice. The x5 cabin is well built so we were not too concerned about the noise. We drove the 535D and liked it a lot... it was responsive and couldn't tell its a diesel. The 2 stage turbo helps with the 8 speed trans.

In response to your inquiry....

1) Maintenance - My mechanic told me that gas engine requires more trips to the shop compared to diesel, overall speaking. Gas engine has smaller problems and occurs more often than diesel. But when diesel breaks, it is more costly and the problem is usually more severe. Diesel burns cooler so less wear/tear, which means longer life. Overall, the less trips to the gas station and MPG should greatly be less expensive than gas engine... for long term ownership... I would not recommend if you are leasing or just want to own it for few years.

2)When the x5 is delivered, I will not opt for the extended service. I have a good relationship with a local mechanic, so no need for extended service. Plus the payout on extended service is low in percentage.

3)From the ML bluetec and E70 D resale standpoint, it is slightly higher over the gas engine counterpart.

Good luck to you.
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      02-16-2014, 07:48 PM   #15
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A good thread with some interesting comments and insights. Later this year we could be looking at trading up from our 2011 X3 30d to an X5. While the diesels are our preferred option (what we here in Australia call the 30d and 40d), I'll also be considering the 35i.

One issue I've noticed with the X3 30d is that (as noted by Aviator JPN above) is that the diesel - while certainly more fuel efficient than the petrol/gas equivalent - isn't as fuel efficient as the official figures suggest. Gas is more closer to its official fuel consumption than diesel (and hybrid is even further away from what I read).

Also I agree with the notion that over the short term (up to 3-5 years) there should be very little to separate the maintenance costs of gas vs diesel. Longer term - and especially out of warranty - diesel repairs can be very expensive.

Just a side note on diesel engine designation. I'm relatively new to this X5 Forum and it took me a while (I'm a little slow) to appreciate that BMW uses different designations for its diesel engines in different markets. What is called the 35d in the US/Canada is called the 30d in Europe and here in Australia. This 35d/30d diesel engine has only a single turbo charger to produce 255hp/413lb-ft (190kW/560Nm) with 0-62mph in 6.9sec. It is the 40d (as available in Europe and here in Australia) which has two turbochargers. It produces 230kW/630Nm or 313hp/465lb-ft with 0-62mph in 5.9sec for the X5. Then we have the M50d with three turbochargers to produce 280kW/740Nm or 381hp/545lf-ft with 0-62mph in 5.3 sec for the X5.

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      02-16-2014, 10:02 PM   #16
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The US 35D comes in 6 cylinder each with 4 valves. The aluminum block is served with variable twin turbos.

The 40D and 50D are not offer in the US market.
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      02-17-2014, 01:17 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bim_power View Post
The US 35D comes in 6 cylinder each with 4 valves. The aluminum block is served with variable twin turbos.
I know we are getting off topic here but this does leave me a little confused. From the BMW USA website the quoted power & torque values for the 35d (255hp / 413 lb-ft) and a 6.7sec time for 0-60mph. These values are identical to those numbers for the 30d engine available in Europe and elsewhere. The only difference is 0-100km/h (0-62mph) time of 6.9sec. The 30d engine only has a single turbocharger. As noted in my previous thread the 40d engine does has two turbochargers which result in significantly different power, torque and performance numbers over the 30d.

I know all these I6 diesel engines are from BMW's N57 engine family, but does anyone have the actual N57 variant number for any of these engines?

Tony
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