Brembo on a budget! Let's make x5 great again :)

[blue dragon]

If you have a copy of Esys, there is a DIY on the forum. Its straightfoward

[tlow]

Doing some googling on x5m (f85) vs m5 (f10) brakes fronts and x5m vs Porsche Cayenne S rears

So rotors are approx the same size at 395mm front and 385-390mm rear
Front pads are slightly larger on the x5m but calipers are 4 position vs 6 piston on the m5?
On the rear Porsche Cayenne S pads are a chunk bigger vs x5m?

[notslow]

I tried searching, but had no luck. Does anyone know the caliper piston diameters for the f85 calipers and MPB calipers? Also how about piston diameter of the 4 piston rear calipers?

I have 996 Porsche calipers and curious if they can be used. Piston diameters would have to be similar to be safe.

[dentprotony@gmail.com]

Fellas hows that for making f15/16 brakes great again ? 6 piston porsche fronts machined to work with a 374mm rotor and fits f15 spindle with a custom bracket, 4 piston porsche rear that will fit with a 50i rear rotor.

These would be a huge improvement over stock set up, larger rotors, larger pad sweep area, much bigger pad and much more efficient heat dissipation over factory brakes perfect for towing or spirited/track driving

Best part is these are much more affordable than 6 piston m set, rotors are 60-120 vs 380ea, plus a vast selection of pads available on the market (my sets come with powerstop pads already installed)

[mcaesar]

Just installed brake upgrade and want to say thanks to Tony for offering these 6 piston front 4 piston rear brembo brake caliper kits. In my case I wanted to improve the braking overall of my 2018 f15 3.5D especially for occasional trailering. As we all know the OE brake set up can be marginal at times. Compared to what is available his kit is very reasonably priced ~ $2,500 which includes refurbished front and rear calipers w/custom brackets and pads. They are beautiful and powerful. Figured if this same set up is OE for a Porche Panamerican it’ll be a improvement over the X5’s OE and save $’s. BTW Tony was also super helpful with selecting the appropriate rotors (rock auto) and braided brake lines.

[djrabbi]

I got a set of x5m in any color you guys want for $1750 fully rebuilt

Below are past customers

[notslow]

So nobody has technical data about the different caliper piston diameters?
It's a bit disconcerting that more of this thread seems to be about painting and color instead of technical data.
I would never randomly install calipers from a different vehicle without knowing that the pad surface area and piston diameters are correct. One thing to use X5M parts with coding, but using Porsche or VW parts blindly is risky.
I believe the X5M uses a different master cylinder as well. This may be to account for more piston surface area with the 6 piston calipers.

[dentprotony@gmail.com]

Originally Posted by notslow

So nobody has technical data about these divergent caliper piston diameters? I would never randomly imsatll calipers from a different vehicle without knowing pad surface area and piston diameters are correct. One thing to use X5M parts with coding, but using Porsche or VW parts blindly is risky.
I believe the X5M uses a different master cylinder as well. This may be to account for more piston surface area with the 6 piston calipers.

Incorrect, x5m has same part number for the master cylinder, porsche or chevy parts are made by the same company that is brembo, it doesnt matter who uses it it matters how its used lol. piston diameter on the cayenne was same, possibly 1mm smaller dia vs f85 brakes that i have. Surprisingly spacing is almost identical to f85 calipers as well. Porsche calipers can be installed in lead/rearward position (they are fully symmetrical) , so would you use f85 calipers on an f0 m5 ? Or cayenne calipers on a panamera ? Hint These are completely different vehicles but calipers are the same. Pads are same for panamera cayenne and macan

[blue dragon]

I think you are missing what he's asking. Is the original brake bias retained? The dsc can alter pressure to adjust individual brakes for things like stability control, trailer sway control, etc. Do these remain the same running different rotors with different pads and calipers from a different manufactuere which will all have different braking moments.

At least with F85 calipers/rotor, you know it works with the F16/F16 chassis and related braking components. Ultimately, the braking system is more than just the sum of calipers and rotors

[notslow]

If the parts are mechanically compatible, that's great. I have Porsche big reds on my old Tahoe 4x4. I had to do a lot of research to figure out that half ton rear drum brakes would be biased wrong. I upgraded to the large drums from the 3/4 ton suburban and all was good.

I made the technical data the priority though, not the caliper color. I can't find any posts on this thread about pad dimensions or piston diameters. If they are compatible, I'll be putting the 6 piston Porsche calipers on the X5. Thanks for letting me know the master cylinder is the same, that simplifies things.

If anyone can post X5M 6 piston caliper piston diameters, I'd greatly appreciate it.

[dentprotony@gmail.com]

Originally Posted by blue dragon

I think you are missing what he's asking. Is the original brake bias retained? The dsc can alter pressure to adjust individual brakes for things like stability control, trailer sway control, etc. Do these remain the same running different rotors with different pads and calipers from a different manufactuere which will all have different braking moments.

At least with F85 calipers/rotor, you know it works with the F16/F16 chassis and related braking components. Ultimately, the braking system is more than just the sum of calipers and rotors

Yep, there more to the braking system, 6 piston calipers from Porsche have very similar diameter and piston spacing, pad size i cannot confirm, i didnt have pads available when i was comparing my f85 and cayenne calipers. Rotor width is the same while diameter differs by 19mm only. Another strange thing is piston diameters between e70 x5 345mm and rear x5m 385mm rotor calipers are same, i just walked outside and confirmed. Theres a lot to braking system but i think it is not down to millimeter, not on e70/f15 platform at least. Lots of parts interchange between x5m f85 and regular f15 (brake hoses, master cylinder, very likely brake bias will not be affected with Porsche kits that i offer. I have 2 customers so far that drive their e70’s like they stole it, they are really rough on their vehicles/brake set ups, i havent heard nothing but good things about my brakes.

PS another strange thing is x5m e70 and f85 X5m use same diameter rotor while one came with 4 piston front, while other came with 6 piston

[dentprotony@gmail.com]

Originally Posted by notslow

If the parts are mechanically compatible, that's great. I have Porsche big reds on my old Tahoe 4x4. I had to do a lot of research to figure out that half ton rear drum brakes would be biased wrong. I upgraded to the large drums from the 3/4 ton suburban and all was good.

I made the technical data the priority though, not the caliper color. I can't find any posts on this thread about pad dimensions or piston diameters. If they are compatible, I'll be putting the 6 piston Porsche calipers on the X5. Thanks for letting me know the master cylinder is the same, that simplifies things.

If anyone can post X5M 6 piston caliper piston diameters, I'd greatly appreciate it.

Ill be doing pads and braided lines on my f85 soon, what else do you need to know besides piston diameter?

[notslow]

Originally Posted by dentprotony@gmail.com

Yep, there more to the braking system, 6 piston calipers from Porsche have very similar diameter and piston spacing, pad size i cannot confirm, i didnt have pads available when i was comparing my f85 and cayenne calipers. Rotor width is the same while diameter differs by 19mm only. Another strange thing is piston diameters between e70 x5 345mm and rear x5m 385mm rotor calipers are same, i just walked outside and confirmed. Theres a lot to braking system but i think it is not down to millimeter, not on e70/f15 platform at least. Lots of parts interchange between x5m f85 and regular f15 (brake hoses, master cylinder, very likely brake bias will not be affected with Porsche kits that i offer. I have 2 customers so far that drive their e70’s like they stole it, they are really rough on their vehicles/brake set ups, i havent heard nothing but good things about my brakes.

PS another strange thing is x5m e70 and f85 X5m use same diameter rotor while one came with 4 piston front, while other came with 6 piston

The X5M six piston calipers likely have smaller pistons than the four piston front calipers on the e70 X5M. I wouldn't be surprised if calculated piston surface area is nearly the same or a small percentage larger. It isn't a surprise that similar weight and balance SUVs and sedans from BMW and Porsche would have similar sized and biased brakes, both companies being so performance oriented.

[notslow]

Originally Posted by dentprotony@gmail.com

Ill be doing pads and braided lines on my f85 soon, what else do you need to know besides piston diameter?

Front caliper piston diameters and pad dimensions would be great.

I believe the rear calipers are the same 44mm piston as my 50i, just with a larger rotor and caliper bracket. Maybe someone can confirm.

[dentprotony@gmail.com]

Originally Posted by notslow

Front caliper piston diameters and pad dimensions would be great.

I believe the rear calipers are the same 44mm piston as my 50i, just with a larger rotor and caliper bracket. Maybe someone can confirm.

35d and x5m rear calipers have same diameter pistons , ill try to get you the dimensions when i get pads done

[jmack123]

Originally Posted by mcaesar

Just installed brake upgrade and want to say thanks to Tony for offering these 6 piston front 4 piston rear brembo brake caliper kits. In my case I wanted to improve the braking overall of my 2018 f15 3.5D especially for occasional trailering. As we all know the OE brake set up can be marginal at times. Compared to what is available his kit is very reasonably priced ~ $2,500 which includes refurbished front and rear calipers w/custom brackets and pads. They are beautiful and powerful. Figured if this same set up is OE for a Porche Panamerican it’ll be a improvement over the X5’s OE and save $’s. BTW Tony was also super helpful with selecting the appropriate rotors (rock auto) and braided brake lines.

I see you are in MA - can I ask where you went to get your brakes installed and how much they charged?

[tlow]

I was just messing around a little comparing pad/surface area sizes. So the front of the m5s use the same pads as the X5m? Is that correct? So the only difference in setups is 400mm rotor plus 6 pistons on the M5 vs 395mm and 4 piston on the X5M?

Would also be curious if anyone knows totally piston surface area compared on each

[dentprotony@gmail.com]

Originally Posted by tlow

I was just messing around a little comparing pad/surface area sizes. So the front of the m5s use the same pads as the X5m? Is that correct? So the only difference in setups is 400mm rotor plus 6 pistons on the M5 vs 395mm and 4 piston on the X5M?

Would also be curious if anyone knows totally piston surface area compared on each

X5m 6 piston caliper is identical to f10 m5, rotors are different, m5 rotor is 5mm larger and 6lbs lighter (it is considered an upgrade in f85 crowd because of major rotational weight reduction), m5 pad is a touch narrower (by 15% or so).

PS i dont know much on 4 piston e70 x5m calipers, i had them on my x35d but they always made an impression of a boat anchor, huge and extremely heavy, id say inferior to their 6 piston f85 counterpart

[tlow]

Found this on bimmerfest:
Comparison is based on 5M brake:

OE Front 4 pot: 42/42mm (27.7 cm^2)
OE Rear single floating: 42 (13.9 cm^2)
Piston area ratio: 67/33 (%)

RB Front 6 pot: 32/34/36 (27.3 cm^2)
RB Rear 4 pot: 30/30 (14.1 cm^2)
Piston area ratio: 66/34 (%)​

OE front pad (D1429) with a dimension (Length x width) of 124x90mm
RB front pad (D1666) Same as Mustang GT500-162x65mm

Full reply: https://www.bimmerfest.com/threads/b...2/post-9336273

I doubt the stopping power of the 4 vs 6 piston fronts is all that different if the areas are about the same. I mean if we’re getting technical the bmw x5m and M5 is a two piece caliper (less movement) and pistons spread across the pad better. But if the pistons center points aren’t different relative the centerline of the hub (aka the braking level arm). Again I doubt that much difference. Also, unless you take it to the track…no one on this forum is using either brakes to their full potential. Ya I get the safety and slowing down sooner aspect.

[mcaesar]

Originally Posted by jmack123

I see you are in MA - can I ask where you went to get your brakes installed and how much they charged?

I’m retired and took my time (over a couple of days) and installed them myself. Any reputable mechanic can swap calipers. I would guess around 4-5 hours to install then another hour for fluid install/bleeding.

[notslow]

After doing a little searching online, I managed to find some technical specs. This info may help others. If any of this is incorrect, please point it out. It would be great if we could add the piston diameters of the Porsche retrofit calipers. Anyone know piston sizes of the Panamera rear caliper people are using?

It looks like there are two different rear calipers for the F15. My 50i has more rear bias than an X5M. This could be due to weight distribution or maybe just because the X5M is designed to be driven more sportingly. The increased rear bias would be good for someone towing a trailer as the rear brakes are more important under that condition.

X5m rotors:
Front 395mm X 36mm
Rear 385mm X 24mm
Calipers:
F85 Front: 30, 34, 36 Surface Area 2632.8
F85 Rear single piston diameter 42mm Surface area 1385


50i Front dual 42mm Surface area 2770
50i Rear single 44mm Surface area 1521


35i:
Front single 60mm
Rear single 44mm

M Performance brakes:
Front 4 piston 42mm
Rear single 42mm

F10 calipers:
Front: Piston diameters 30, 34, 36
F10 Rear single piston diameter 42mm

[dentprotony@gmail.com]

Originally Posted by notslow

After doing a little searching online, I managed to find some technical specs. This info may help others. If any of this is incorrect, please point it out. It would be great if we could add the piston diameters of the Porsche retrofit calipers. Anyone know piston sizes of the Panamera rear caliper people are using?

It looks like there are two different rear calipers for the F15. My 50i has more rear bias than an X5M. This could be due to weight distribution or maybe just because the X5M is designed to be driven more sportingly. The increased rear bias would be good for someone towing a trailer as the rear brakes are more important under that condition.

X5m rotors:
Front 395mm X 36mm
Rear 385mm X 24mm
Calipers:
F85 Front: 30, 34, 36 Surface Area 2632.8
F85 Rear single piston diameter 42mm Surface area 1385


50i Front dual 42mm Surface area 2770
50i Rear single 44mm Surface area 1521


35i:
Front single 60mm
Rear single 44mm

M Performance brakes:
Front 4 piston 42mm
Rear single 42mm

F10 calipers:
Front: Piston diameters 30, 34, 36
F10 Rear single piston diameter 42mm

Porsche front 6 piston caliper piston diameter is 33/34mm all same , rear seems to be 27/28mm dia