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      09-15-2018, 05:15 PM   #1
kanvas
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This ONE issue... need your help!

I have been having this one issue for a while. When accelerating (3/4 to full throttle), the car shakes violently and DING! --- drivetrain malfunction. Then, at idle, the car shakes very rough. If I turn off the engine for about 20 minutes, the warning goes away and the car is fine. As long I don't floor it, the car is fine.

Went to the dealer 3 times for this: replaced all spark plugs, mass air flow sensor, etc... and the issue keeps coming back! So I went to an independent mechanic. He test drove it and got these results. The X5 had 20 miles worth of gas left and he pointed that out. "Don't drive the car when it's running below quarter tank!" he says. He says that COULD be one of the contributing factors, since there's a pump inside the tank and having plenty of fuel is important (I don't remember the exact explanation, but something along the lines of that).

So I filled up the tank and floored it, and the problem reappeared. Other than this, nothing wrong with the X5, which I am thankful. But it's this ONE issue that keeps coming back. Anyone know why this happens? I'm all ears here.

Thanks.
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      09-15-2018, 06:08 PM   #2
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Lets assess and eliminate the probability of this misfire and correlate what you've done.

ISTA/D says to eliminate the following
Air supply
Ignition
Fuel Supply
Electrical
Mechanical

-Air supply, which you've already addressed with new maf, and no other codes are indicating this issue it can be R/O, however check the air filter and replace as needed and inspect any intake hoses for leaks.

-Ignition, you've already replaced the plugs but no avail, perhaps check the coil packs? If you're handy you could switch around the Coil packs to see if the cylinder misfire follows the coil pack, But you need to find out of cylinder 3 and 6 is are always misfiring when you floor (as noted in fault code multiple misfire) it which means you need a code reader perhaps an OBD II reader should suffice.

-Fuel Supply, now it did say fuel injector cut off on 3 and 6 but its performing that under misfire circumstance (ie Engine Malfunction Light) to protect the engine, however it should be taken consideration if the Ignition coils are not the culprit, and if cylinder 3 and 6 keeps misfiring and shutting off the injectors, a more comprehensive diagnostic is needed for that case.

-Electrical its safe to say its not electric since there aren't any other codes indicating it however it should be taken in consideration if the preceding does not rectify

-Mechanical, very unlikely since the engine performs normally, as per stated and no codes indicating it.


Keep us updated

Last edited by Mr.47; 09-15-2018 at 06:16 PM.
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      09-15-2018, 06:34 PM   #3
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When you say the issue keeps coming back, you mean it ran good for a little after plugs changed? Etc
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      09-15-2018, 06:54 PM   #4
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+1 for coils
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      09-15-2018, 07:04 PM   #5
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Can you log fuel pressure? Sounds similar to how my n54 motor acted when the hpfp was going. When I logged it you can see the drop in pressure from 800-900 to below 100 when in the upper rev range. That's when things go bad and the motor protects itself. So worth a shot.
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      09-15-2018, 07:29 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kanvas View Post
I have been having this one issue for a while. When accelerating (3/4 to full throttle), the car shakes violently and DING! --- drivetrain malfunction. Then, at idle, the car shakes very rough. If I turn off the engine for about 20 minutes, the warning goes away and the car is fine. As long I don't floor it, the car is fine.

Went to the dealer 3 times for this: replaced all spark plugs, mass air flow sensor, etc... and the issue keeps coming back! So I went to an independent mechanic. He test drove it and got these results. The X5 had 20 miles worth of gas left and he pointed that out. "Don't drive the car when it's running below quarter tank!" he says. He says that COULD be one of the contributing factors, since there's a pump inside the tank and having plenty of fuel is important (I don't remember the exact explanation, but something along the lines of that).

So I filled up the tank and floored it, and the problem reappeared. Other than this, nothing wrong with the X5, which I am thankful. But it's this ONE issue that keeps coming back. Anyone know why this happens? I'm all ears here.

Thanks.
What you are describing sounds like a bad coil to me. Get them swapped. At $25 what do you have to lose?

The other possibility is bad fuel injector. Highly doubt itís fuel pump as you are only showing issue with one cylinder. If it was fuel pump, I assume it would cause other cylinders to misbehave.
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      09-15-2018, 08:39 PM   #7
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had similar issues on my 335is with n54 engine. for a few months driving it hard would cause the car to stutter at high rpms and trip warnings, and then a bad idle, but restarting the engine and driving normally seems to clear up the errors/stuttering problem. didnt look into it for quite some time and one day the car would not idle anymore, it would crank, fires and dies. turns out 3 of the 6 injectors were bad, and of course happened 1 month after warranty expired.
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      09-15-2018, 09:52 PM   #8
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Had the same exact problem with my old 03 325i. You could ease into it and it would be fine, but if you floored it it would stall and stop and shake and all the cluster lights would flash. I donít remember what or if I ever found the problem.
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      09-16-2018, 12:29 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LocksmithNick View Post
Had the same exact problem with my old 03 325i. You could ease into it and it would be fine, but if you floored it it would stall and stop and shake and all the cluster lights would flash. I donít remember what or if I ever found the problem.
Did you burn it?
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      09-16-2018, 12:48 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.47 View Post
Lets assess and eliminate the probability of this misfire and correlate what you've done.

ISTA/D says to eliminate the following
Air supply
Ignition
Fuel Supply
Electrical
Mechanical

-Air supply, which you've already addressed with new maf, and no other codes are indicating this issue it can be R/O, however check the air filter and replace as needed and inspect any intake hoses for leaks.

-Ignition, you've already replaced the plugs but no avail, perhaps check the coil packs? If you're handy you could switch around the Coil packs to see if the cylinder misfire follows the coil pack, But you need to find out of cylinder 3 and 6 is are always misfiring when you floor (as noted in fault code multiple misfire) it which means you need a code reader perhaps an OBD II reader should suffice.

-Fuel Supply, now it did say fuel injector cut off on 3 and 6 but its performing that under misfire circumstance (ie Engine Malfunction Light) to protect the engine, however it should be taken consideration if the Ignition coils are not the culprit, and if cylinder 3 and 6 keeps misfiring and shutting off the injectors, a more comprehensive diagnostic is needed for that case.

-Electrical its safe to say its not electric since there aren't any other codes indicating it however it should be taken in consideration if the preceding does not rectify

-Mechanical, very unlikely since the engine performs normally, as per stated and no codes indicating it.


Keep us updated
Super appreciate the comprehensive post! Maybe not fuel supply related either, since I filled the tank up and test drove it and the issue came back. The mechanic cleared all error codes and engine light. Gut feelings say coils. Should get a diagnostic test with the independent mechanic.
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      09-16-2018, 12:52 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turboawd View Post
When you say the issue keeps coming back, you mean it ran good for a little after plugs changed? Etc
Correct. When dealer changed all spark plugs, it was smooth for a few days, but that was it: only a few days. I'm surprised that after three visits, they were still unable to diagnose the problem.
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      09-16-2018, 12:54 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joyride View Post
Can you log fuel pressure? Sounds similar to how my n54 motor acted when the hpfp was going. When I logged it you can see the drop in pressure from 800-900 to below 100 when in the upper rev range. That's when things go bad and the motor protects itself. So worth a shot.
How do you "log" fuel pressure. Do I need equipment to do that?
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      09-16-2018, 12:57 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TOPEC View Post
had similar issues on my 335is with n54 engine. for a few months driving it hard would cause the car to stutter at high rpms and trip warnings, and then a bad idle, but restarting the engine and driving normally seems to clear up the errors/stuttering problem. didnt look into it for quite some time and one day the car would not idle anymore, it would crank, fires and dies. turns out 3 of the 6 injectors were bad, and of course happened 1 month after warranty expired.
I'm out of warranty too, but I'd rather have this diagnosed with a trustworthy independent mechanic rather than the dealership. They just can't get to the root of the problem right away. Should look into injectors..
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      09-16-2018, 12:58 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LocksmithNick View Post
Had the same exact problem with my old 03 325i. You could ease into it and it would be fine, but if you floored it it would stall and stop and shake and all the cluster lights would flash. I donít remember what or if I ever found the problem.
That's exactly the issue! This is starting to sound a more common issue than I thought it'd be.
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      09-16-2018, 06:20 AM   #15
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I had the same problem and the same codes. I changed my plugs first and that didn't rectify the issue. I changed the coils next and... voila, no more problems.
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      09-16-2018, 08:24 AM   #16
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It's fairly easy to move coils, see if the error follows the move. If it does, then that's the issue. The shop should have known that.
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      09-16-2018, 08:26 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turboawd View Post
Did you burn it?
Haha it was 10 years old and paid off. Windows didnít go up or down, interior trim was always falling off, trans starting doing something weird. Sold the car for $1000 lol.
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      Yesterday, 09:41 AM   #18
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How many miles on your car? When your car has misfire, it's always a good idea to change plugs and coils together.
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