Diminished Value Claim?

[khp3655]

My 2022 Z4 just got hit. It was parked and the person who hit the car is taking responsibility and their insurance will cover the repairs. The damage is noticeable (rear passenger corner), but minor. No sensors involved and the car drives fine.

My concern is the diminished value through Carfax and other sites. Trade-in value drops as soon as you check the box at trade-in that says "any accidents"?

Any tips for how to ask for diminished value through the insurance company? (I am in VA, accident was in MD). What kind of appraisal will I need to get? I know that I can show the difference on Caravan or Carmax through the reduced offers they will provide between a no-accident car and a car with an accident.

I appreciate other's input on this.

[blinsc]

It depends on the insurance company that is covering the repairs.

A few years ago I had a (at the time) brand new AMG C63S get side-swiped. The car was like 4 months old. I had dents and scratches along the entire driver side and the total repair cost billed to insurance was $14k (about $3k of that was because they had to replace half of the XPEL wrap, and the body shop marked that up 25% even though they outsourced it to the place that did it originally).

I hired someone that specializes in diminished value and they prepared a document and I also got three separate appraisals (CarMax, a Mercedes dealership, and another place I can't remember) to show that the vehicle lost between $8-12k in value.

GEICO, who was covering the driver at fault, did not really care at all about any of that, and wouldn't even look at the documents and appraisals. Instead, they sent their own person out to examine my vehicle post-repair. I threatened to sue them and they offered me $1000. I rejected it and called a couple lawyers and long story short, I went back and accepted the $1000. The guy I hired cost me $450, which in retrospect was a mistake.

When I ultimately traded the vehicle, the place that bought it gave me about $5k less than what a clean example would've gone for.

[DanG]

I’m my area you can get a diminished value appraisal showing the difference in value before and after the accident. You then submit the appraisal to the other drivers insurance company.

You usually wait until after the repairs so that the quality of the repair is included in the appraisal.

[Tobster3]

Originally Posted by blinsc

It depends on the insurance company that is covering the repairs.

A few years ago I had a (at the time) brand new AMG C63S get side-swiped. The car was like 4 months old. I had dents and scratches along the entire driver side and the total repair cost billed to insurance was $14k (about $3k of that was because they had to replace half of the XPEL wrap, and the body shop marked that up 25% even though they outsourced it to the place that did it originally).

I hired someone that specializes in diminished value and they prepared a document and I also got three separate appraisals (CarMax, a Mercedes dealership, and another place I can't remember) to show that the vehicle lost between $8-12k in value.

GEICO, who was covering the driver at fault, did not really care at all about any of that, and wouldn't even look at the documents and appraisals. Instead, they sent their own person out to examine my vehicle post-repair. I threatened to sue them and they offered me $1000. I rejected it and called a couple lawyers and long story short, I went back and accepted the $1000. The guy I hired cost me $450, which in retrospect was a mistake.

That’ crazy!

[khp3655]

The insurance company I will be dealing with is Nationwide. The body shop I am going to use said they have contacts with people who will help with appraisals/diminished value -- for a fee.

It seems like the diminished value should be pretty straight forward. I put my car into Caravana or CarMax and get values $x and $x-$y. Perhaps that would at least give me an opening position?

It sounds like I should just complain and threaten to sue and hope for the best. That seems better than doing nothing.

[tturedraider]

Diminished value is a relatively new thing and I think it is probably driven mostly by CarFax reporting. Anyway, as such it is very difficult to get insurance companies to agree to pay and it is very difficult to get them to pay a fair amount. I predict one these days there is going to be a class action lawsuit against CarFax for the times their reporting is not accurate and negatively affects the value of cars for which they report inaccurate information.

More than a decade ago now I had a car that was truly totaled by a guy who drove his pickup into the back of it while it was parked and literally pushed the trunk all the way to the base of the back window. I honestly don’t know how the repair was made, but someone bought it and repaired it and sold it. I ran a CarFax report on it about five years later and absolutely nothing showed up on the report.

[Nettles]

I can share my experience. I filed for a diminshed value claim back in 2012 for my E36 M3. It got side swiped on the driver's side and started doing some research on the process. At the time from what I could gather everyone who had ever dealt with a diminished value claim had lost. You can submit one all day long, but getting your insurance to approve it is the real challenge.

I had a very good case. 1999 E36 M3 coupe, manual, Dinan Stage 5, Techno Violet over Mulberry vader seats purchased with 99k miles. I wrote a lengthy letter explaining why the car had lost its value and cited many data points from production numbers to comps and even listing prices nationwide at the time. I was only 21, but looking back on it I did a damn good job. It led to a conclusion of wanting basically the delta of what the car was worth at the time no accident vs. accident pricing.

They denied my claim. Don't pay a lawyer, spend an afternoon writing up something compelling, and push until you're over it. I would set the expectations low, but every state/adjuster/company/etc. could be a luck of the draw. Doesn't cost anything but your time.

[Windshieldfarmer]

When acquiring fairly expensive car I prefer leasing rather than purchasing…for this very reason. Assuming quality repairs are completed the lessee won’t be at risk for diminished value.

[Westside Guy]

Originally Posted by khp3655

My 2022 Z4 just got hit. It was parked and the person who hit the car is taking responsibility and their insurance will cover the repairs. The damage is noticeable (rear passenger corner), but minor. No sensors involved and the car drives fine.

My concern is the diminished value through Carfax and other sites. Trade-in value drops as soon as you check the box at trade-in that says "any accidents"?

Any tips for how to ask for diminished value through the insurance company? (I am in VA, accident was in MD). What kind of appraisal will I need to get? I know that I can show the difference on Caravan or Carmax through the reduced offers they will provide between a no-accident car and a car with an accident.

I appreciate other's input on this.

The laws vary from state to state,Virginia and Maryland both recognize diminished value claims and you need to establish which state's laws apply. There are attorneys and companies that specialize in filing and recovering money and take a nice size percentage of the amount they recover. This is similar what an attorney does when they take a case on a contingency basis where they usually get 33% of the amount awarded in a settlement.

The Statute of Limitations will vary from state to state. Maryland is 3 years and Virginia is 5 years.

Before you proceed you also you need to consider how what your real loss in value is for a minor repair like this.

[khp3655]

Originally Posted by Westside Guy

The laws vary from state to state,Virginia and Maryland both recognize diminished value claims and you need to establish which state's laws apply. There are attorneys and companies that specialize in filing and recovering money and take a nice size percentage of the amount they recover. This is similar what an attorney does when they take a case on a contingency basis where they usually get 33% of the amount awarded in a settlement.

The Statute of Limitations will vary from state to state. Maryland is 3 years and Virginia is 5 years.

Before you proceed you also you need to consider how what your real loss in value is for a minor repair like this.

I feel like my loss will be difference between what CarMax/Carvana etc. will offer me for the car with zero accidents vs one accident. The one thing I know is that the offer will be less. That's a diminished value, at least in my (meaningless ) opinion.

[drunkenup]

I had a 20 F150 get hit while parked, repair was about $2000. The insurer was Geico, I paid 350 for an appraisal from a company that writes for diminished value. That appraisal compared no accident vs accident trade in quotes from Vroom, and some fancy legalese. They never saw the truck in person. My advise is not to use these services.

After some back and forth, and some holes poked, by me, into Geico's claim that no value was lost, they offered $400 based on their third party appraisal (who never saw the truck). Maybe, Geico is a common denominator in poor outcomes. I decry anyone who carries their insurance and celebrate those well-deserved, disproportionately high, post-at fault claim rate hikes.

I haven't accepted yet, and I left a VM that I would be looking to sue the other driver. The company I bought the appraisal from claims the insurer will come to the table and negotiate the moment I file to take their insured to small claims. I am considering another "consultant", who based on their own account, seems to talk to the claims teams at the insurance companies. I've since traded the truck in, and, obviously, took $2000 loss of trade in value due to the carfax inquiry.

[Rob_G77]

Originally Posted by drunkenup

I've since traded the truck in, and, obviously, took $2000 loss of trade in value due to the carfax inquiry.

For $2k, I wouldn't want the aggravation.

My M850i got backed into and the damage was about $4k to repair. New rear bumper and a repaint of the rear quarter panel because it had a slight buckle.

The paint match was not good and parts were missing which all made the repair process such a horrible experience. For a car that already has bad resale value, this was making things a whole lot worse for me. I traded it back to the dealership and lost about $13k. Could have been a lot worse. The dealership actually didn't care (too much) about the damage because it was less than $5k and nothing structural.

It's still sitting on the used lot for sale 4 months later. The dealership is even going to lose money on it.

Diminished value doesn't exist in Canada. A few people have sued for it, but generally the insurance companies won't do anything. Like some guy said earlier, maybe lease an expensive car...

Rob

[crashoverride]

Having worked at a dealership for many years. Unless it's a really new car or a limited specialty car (I worked at a Mercedes-Benz dealership too) diminished value is really only something told to scare customers.
Sure if two equal cars are offered and one has been repaired the other never damaged there is a difference. But realistically no one is coming in saying the car we are selling needs to be X less because of an accident. They are buying the car because it fits there needs at their budget and has the features and more that they are looking for.
There is an entire industry lawyers etc that specialize in diminished value but it's an uphill battle full of additional costs on the consumer to prove anything.

[RockCrusher]

After my 2020 Scat Pack was repaired I did a DV claim. (Car hit while parked outside my apartment in an assigned space.)

Damage repairs totaled around $8200.

Car hit mid January 2021. (Bought it new Nov. 2020!)

Probably sometime in middle to late February I contacted Auto Appraisal Group about a DV appraisal.

Link:

https://www.autoappraisal.com/

Got in touch and scheduled a time for the appraiser to view the car. He was coming from IIRC Tulsa OK which is 110 miles away.

Was told what I needed to have. Copy of the title. Copy of the repair paperwork. Maybe something else. Probably pics of the damage. Even if this wasn't requested I had plenty of good pics.

Guy showed up on time. Took the copies of what I had ready for him. Gave the car a very good going over. He took lots of pics.

But he was not the appraiser. He was just gathering info for the appraiser.

After a week or two the appraisal showed up. The appraiser had the car's DV amount $5876. Before accident value: $39,175.00. After accident and repairs value: $33,299.00.

As I was instructed I went to a highly regarded use car dealer to get some prices. Walked up and said "Buy my car". Showed the dealer the pics of the damage. The repair paperwork. The used car dealer offered me more than the car was appraised for. He offered me $41,000. I had not shared with him what AAG appraisal value was.

So I had no real ammo to go along with the AAG appraisal.

Submitted a claim against the at fault driver's insurance for the DV. Long story short I settled for $2500. (The insurance company either offered $0 or I seem to recall maybe $1000.)

Appraisal cost me $450.

[khp3655]

The general message I am getting is:
1. It doesn't hurt to ask for diminished value, but don't expect much.
2. Don't waste too much time or effort on it, and have low expectations.
3. The $1-2K loss I will probably take down the road isn't really worth fighting over. Life isn't always fair and no one is going to go out of their way to address this.

I guess I will focus my attention on getting a high quality repair and making sure they replace the gashed, slightly displaced, and dented bumper cover rather than do some filler and paint job.

[Chihuahua]

Originally Posted by khp3655

The general message I am getting is:
1. It doesn't hurt to ask for diminished value, but don't expect much.
2. Don't waste too much time or effort on it, and have low expectations.
3. The $1-2K loss I will probably take down the road isn't really worth fighting over. Life isn't always fair and no one is going to go out of their way to address this.

I guess I will focus my attention on getting a high quality repair and making sure they replace the gashed, slightly displaced, and dented bumper cover rather than do some filler and paint job.

Correct on all points. DV is quite subjective; any appraiser, insurance company, dealer, etc is going to use their own mathematical formula to calculate DV. Who is right and who is wrong is always subject to interpretation, and it's operating under the assumption that you're going to sell your car immediately after getting it back from repairs. Someone buying your car today will care about a crash repair to a bumper in 2024, so there's 'X' amount of value associated with that. Assuming you keep it long term, no one buying your car twenty years from now is going to care, so DV is zero. An accurate DV value is somewhere in that big ol' grey area.

[SharpAndCunning]

It really depends on your policy. In massachusetts most of the policies state they will not pay diminished value, but there are places that have tried and gotten diminished value results for their customers.

[SpaceSilver.X1]

don't trust CarFax reports.... not all major body repairs are documented.

I had a major front end collision before. insurance paid around $10. I had the repair performed by a Mercedes dealer's own body shop. They did an amazing job repairing/replacing/repainting the hood, fender, headlights, and front bumper.

A few years later, I needed to get all of my owned cars appraised(not because I needed to sell it, but for other financial reasons). Went to CarMax and two Mercedes dealers(not the one that performed the repairs) to get written quoted from them. None of them could not tell that the car had any body repair done. CarFax report showed nothing, which was a surprise to me.

[khp3655]

Short update: car is in the shop. All new parts coming, no filler, etc. Should be ready in a few days. I do plan to ask for diminished value. And I just did my homework on diminished value: it is real. Now, the question is how to try and claim this?

Carvana no damage: 38,000
Carvana, one accident: 34,200


Wow. Just wow.