DIY F85/86 Differential Fluid Change

[FirstBMWLA]

Originally Posted by Chilled

Lol, im going to bed. The more i look at it, the worse it gets. the pre 2011 E70, were the 987, but post were all G2, and then it switches the info sheet back to the pre 2011 for the F85.


L-R, F85, E70 X5M 2013, E70 X5M 2008

Maybe it just doesn't matter?
If they're going back and forth with no real change to the differential maybe they're all interchangeable and they based recommendations at that time on product availability or something else.

[Chilled]

Originally Posted by FirstBMWLA

Maybe it just doesn't matter?
If they're going back and forth with no real change to the differential maybe they're all interchangeable and they based recommendations at that time on product availability or something else.

Well considering that RealOEM still don't have the F95/F96, a F15 50iX takes G2, I would say RealOEM messed up and haven't updates their info correctly.

[MBoss_F86]

I found this in FCP Euro, they sell a kit for rear diff service. They clearly mention this which somewhat lines up with ISTA.

https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/bmw...kt#description

Product Information
This kit is designed for servicing QMV torque-vectoring differentials. You may not know but your BMW's QMV differential uses two different fluids. This service kit includes the required volume of fluids to service the outer torque vectoring chambers as well as the main differential chamber. It is important to fill the individual chambers to the correct fluid levels as outlined by BMW:

Center chamber: Uses 75W90, fill capacity is .95 ± .02 liters
Left chamber: Uses SAF Carbon Mod, fill capacity is .54 ± .02 liters
Right chamber: Uses SAF Carbon Mod, fill capacity is .58 ± .02 liters

only thing that is bothering me is WHY 3 different BMW dealers told me use same fluid for front and all rear when we are finding other things else where. I think we are onto something here folks lol

[FirstBMWLA]

Originally Posted by MBoss_F86

I found this in FCP Euro, they sell a kit for rear diff service. They clearly mention this which somewhat lines up with ISTA.

https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/bmw...kt#description

Product Information
This kit is designed for servicing QMV torque-vectoring differentials. You may not know but your BMW's QMV differential uses two different fluids. This service kit includes the required volume of fluids to service the outer torque vectoring chambers as well as the main differential chamber. It is important to fill the individual chambers to the correct fluid levels as outlined by BMW:

Center chamber: Uses 75W90, fill capacity is .95 ± .02 liters
Left chamber: Uses SAF Carbon Mod, fill capacity is .54 ± .02 liters
Right chamber: Uses SAF Carbon Mod, fill capacity is .58 ± .02 liters

only thing that is bothering me is WHY 3 different BMW dealers told me use same fluid for front and all rear when we are finding other things else where. I think we are onto something here folks lol

admittedly I haven't reviewed the design, but unless all sections are sealed from one another it's hard to imagine all the fluids not just mixing together anyway.

[MBoss_F86]

Originally Posted by FirstBMWLA

admittedly I haven't reviewed the design, but unless all sections are sealed from one another it's hard to imagine all the fluids not just mixing together anyway.

As per my knowledge they are not sealed. I could be wrong. May be that is the why BMW said use same fluid on all 3 chambers

[Yuille36]

Originally Posted by MBoss_F86

As per my knowledge they are not sealed. I could be wrong. May be that is the why BMW said use same fluid on all 3 chambers

Each chamber of the rear diff is sealed and are separate from each other. The left and right chambers hold the clutch packs, and the center section holds the ring and pinion. Hence the use of three different sets of fill and drain plugs, and the rear diff has a total of 6 of them. I just did flush and fill last November.

[///MCollection]

The information I uploaded earlier was from Bmw for an f85 chassis and is current.

The diff is not sealed so oils can mix, hence don't tip it and don't use the fill plug as a level plug in their repair instructions

I have also not seen Bmw say use the same oil in all 3 chambers in my travels

[Chilled]

Originally Posted by ///MCollection

The information I uploaded earlier was from Bmw for an f85 chassis and is current.

The diff is not sealed so oils can mix, hence don't tip it and don't use the fill plug as a level plug in their repair instructions

I have also not seen Bmw say use the same oil in all 3 chambers in my travels

///MCollection ,
Just looking at the front diff.

I know RealOEM says to use BMW Synthetic OSP (83222365987), however after looking up ISTA for F85, it recommends G2. As per my posts RealOEM recommends the G2 for the E70 X5M for 2011+, but flips back to 987 for the F85. It looks like they copied the info from the pre2011 X5m, and used that as the list for the F85.

So is your recommendation to use 987 for the front diff, based on RealOEM or dealer/other?

[///MCollection]

That is what the bmw uk dealer catalogue lists.

[Chilled]

did some futile digging.

It looks like the front diff Part # is the same across 50i and the M range, but only for the 50i is the G2 recommended.

The difference between the BMW Synthetic OSP (83222365987) and the G2 appears to be that 987 is 75w90 and the G2 is 75W85. With that, i am more comfortable running something that has a slightly thicker rating.

I concede, might call BMW.

[Chilled]

conceded, called the dealer, they said front is 987.

[MBoss_F86]

I gave my VIN and this is what BMW dealer told me today. Front is G2 and rear is 987. So i assume 987 in all 3 rear chambers?


Hi Sajin, sorry for the wait – I had our shop foreman pull the repair instructions for both differentials:


The only difference would be on vehicles produced from 3/2020 and take the Hypoid G5 fluid in the front axle.

Take a look and let me know what you think.

[Chilled]

Originally Posted by MBoss_F86

I gave my VIN and this is what BMW dealer told me today. Front is G2 and rear is 987. So i assume 987 in all 3 rear chambers?

Take a look and let me know what you think.

The page he printed for the rear is just the sales sheet for 987 oil, not the compatible list. See the front list, there is a button "sales info".


For me the concerning part is the Front. Ista officially says one thing, everything else says something else. It could be a M thing, just does not make sense why they went to G2 for the 2011+ for the X5M, then flipped back to the 987 for the F85.

Plus considering the diff part # is the same across all.

[MBoss_F86]

Aaah got it. So 987 for front and rear middle. 832 carbon for rear outers.

[MBoss_F86]

Haha great timing. Watch this fcpeuro video from 14:11. He said carbon mod on outers and 75W-90 in middle for rears

[Chilled]

Originally Posted by MBoss_F86

Aaah got it. So 987 for front and rear middle. 832 carbon for rear outers.

yep. correct.

But the question is why is ISTA point at the G2 for the Front.

[MBoss_F86]

I am planning to use G2 for front. As ISTA and FCPEuro also recommends the same.

Also I am unable to find 83222365987. Not sure if it is discontinued and replaced by 07512293972. They both are SAF-XO SAE 75W-90. If i cant find 987 I will use 972

*EDIT* As per BMW SA - The 07-51-2-293-972 has replaced the 83-22-2-365-987

Front - 2 x 0.5L
BMW G2 Hypoid Differential Fluid (500mL) - Genuine BMW 83222413511

Rear(Outer Chambers) - 3 x 0.5L
BMW Final-Drive Gear Oil Carbon Mod SAE 75W-85 - BMW (83-12-0-445-832)

Rear(Middle Chamber) - 1 x 1L
SAF-XO Rear Axle Differential Fluid, SAE 75W-90 - BMW (83222365987 or 07512293972)


What pissed me off is when I literally called three M certified dealers are said use 972 for both front and rear. At this point I would trust ISTA and FCPEuro over the dealer

[Blue By You]

Originally Posted by MBoss_F86

I am planning to use G2 for front. As ISTA and FCPEuro also recommends the same.

Also I am unable to find 83222365987. Not sure if it is discontinued and replaced by 07512293972. They both are SAF-XO SAE 75W-90. If i cant find 987 I will use 972

*EDIT* As per BMW SA - The 07-51-2-293-972 has replaced the 83-22-2-365-987

Front - 2 x 0.5L
BMW G2 Hypoid Differential Fluid (500mL) - Genuine BMW 83222413511

Rear(Outer Chambers) - 3 x 0.5L
BMW Final-Drive Gear Oil Carbon Mod SAE 75W-85 - BMW (83-12-0-445-832)

Rear(Middle Chamber) - 1 x 1L
SAF-XO Rear Axle Differential Fluid, SAE 75W-90 - BMW (83222365987 or 07512293972)


What pissed me off is when I literally called three M certified dealers are said use 972 for both front and rear. At this point I would trust ISTA and FCPEuro over the dealer

Not to debate anything, because you guys know a LOT more about this stuff than I do. Just a heads up that my indy just used the 987 on my service. (2017 F85)

[Chilled]

Originally Posted by Blue By You

Not to debate anything, because you guys know a LOT more about this stuff than I do. Just a heads up that my indy just used the 987 on my service. (2017 F85)

Nope, i have no clue what i am doing. Just asking questions and regurgitating ISTA/RealOEM.

I'm the same, I had no issues getting the 987 from my dealer, funny enough its the only oil they had on hand. All others they needed to order in.

I don't think the G2/987 for the front diff would make that much of a difference as from my limited research diffs mechanically were the same from pre 2011 and post.

I will be holding off on doing the front diff for the moment, mainly because i forgot to get a new set of bolts for the reinforcement plate. I will keep poking around on the G2 change, until I get the bolts.

[Chilled]

///MCollection , Yuille36 When you guys did the rear diff. Did you do it when it was cold or hot.

Just looking at the instruction on it and they say "Only change oil when rear axle final drive is at normal operating temperature." and yet i see pics and videos of guys doing their diffs, whilst leaning on the exhaust. If the diff is at temp, the exhaust seems like it would be hot.

So is it just a matter of filling back in the exact amount I took out or do i need to bring the diff up to temp before/after, like the transmission..

[Chilled]

So I decided to poke my head under the car finally, and had my usual "wtf, that's not what I expected" moment. So I was looking for a jack point on the rear diff, and nope non there. I could not see a area on the diff that was flat, or did not have any fins and looked structural/solid. As per.


Found these threads that go into it, but it looks like the ones that do jack the car up via rear, do it via the fins.
https://www.xbimmers.com/forums/show....php?t=1429596
https://f15.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1712006
https://f15.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1708989


So would the rear subframe be the better point? I vid below, looks like there is a nice flat, level section that even looks likes it's meant to be a point.

View post on imgur.com

[bmwx5er]

Originally Posted by Chilled

So I decided to poke my head under the car finally, and had my usual "wtf, that's not what I expected" moment. So I was looking for a jack point on the rear diff, and nope non there. I could not see a area on the diff that was flat, or did not have any fins and looked structural/solid. As per.
Attachment 2726251

Found these threads that go into it, but it looks like the ones that do jack the car up via rear, do it via the fins.
https://www.xbimmers.com/forums/show....php?t=1429596
https://f15.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1712006
https://f15.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1708989


So would the rear subframe be the better point? I vid below, looks like there is a nice flat, level section that even looks likes it's meant to be a point.
Attachment 2726253

View post on imgur.com

I lifted the rear of my X5m at the rear diff fins a few times in the past, for brake flushes and tire swap (based on StatenEye's post in one of the threads you listed)